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With spring football practice approaching, reporters met with USC’s staff to talk about the Trojans. We gave you our first 15 thoughts out of those interviews in this week’s Times of Troy newsletter.

(You can subscribe to the Times of Troy here for that news in your inbox every Monday morning.)

But there’s still more to share. Here are 10 more notes, quotes and things to know ahead of spring football …

1. “Everybody thinks he’s the No.1 player in the country for a reason,” defensive line coach Shaun Nua said of freshman Luke Wafle. “He has the potential, the mentality, the character. It’s our job to make sure we maximize that on a consistent basis.”

2. The most encouraging development on USC’s defensive front? “Depth is the greatest friend you can have,” Nua said. He’ll certainly have more of it this season. Assuming his freshmen up front settle in quickly. Wafle is sure to play, while freshman defensive tackles Jameion Wingfield and Tomhuini Topui look primed for early roles. That’s in addition to Jahkeem Stewart, an All-American as a freshman, and fellow rising sophomore Floyd Boucard, who was a standout in stretches last season.

3. Skyler Jones, USC’s new defensive tackles coach, got his break in college football because of Eric Henderson. Now, with Henderson back in the NFL, Jones got promoted in his place at USC. Jones said he cried when coach Lincoln Riley told him the good news. He’ll be a critical figure in improving USC’s interior, and in developing Stewart. It’s a huge opportunity, but I think Jones is capable of continuing Henderson’s work. “Dawgwork is alive,” Jones said. “Dawgwork isn’t going anywhere.”

4. Of all the new coaching hires, Mike Ekeler impressed me most. Ekeler said he left Nebraska because he already built a strong foundation for the Cornhuskers’ special teams, which he said were now “on cruise control.” He didn’t like the feeling of being comfortable, he said. He wanted a challenge — and he’ll get a double dose with USC’s linebackers and special teams units. Last season, Nebraska was great on kick return while also blocking five kicks. The Trojans had a good kicker … but that’s about all the nice things you can say about the special teams.

5. According to Ekeler, even “Ray Charles could see we have a talented linebacker room here.” If that’s true, we haven’t seen that talent harnessed yet. USC is putting a lot of faith in the untapped potential of Desman Stephens and Jadyn Walker, who both have very particular skill sets for defensive coordinator Gary Patterson to utilize. But Ekeler is convincing: “Over 30 linebackers that I’ve coached have gone to the NFL,” he said. “We’ve got guys in our room with that ability. Now it’s just about getting that out of them.”

6. Another great quote from Ekeler, who was asked about the perception that Riley can’t have a good defense: “Anybody who says that Lincoln Riley doesn’t care about defense, I’d have to check their oil.”

Jontez Williams returns an interception for Iowa State last season.

(Justin Hayworth / Associated Press)

7. Safe to say that Jontez Williams will open spring as USC’s CB1. Cornerbacks coach Trovon Reed said he saw the Iowa State transfer as “the best all-around player in the portal.” That’s high praise, but USC made Williams its top target this offseason for a reason. It’s been a while since USC had a true shutdown corner.

8. The other cornerback spot is wide open. I didn’t get the impression that Chasen Johnson, who was expected to fill a starting spot last season, is assured to play opposite Williams in the fall. There’s Marcelles Williams as well as RJ Sermons, who would’ve been one of the top recruits in this year’s class if he hadn’t reclassified. Prophet Brown also could play outside if he doesn’t play in the slot.

9. Don’t be surprised if freshman corner Elbert “Rock” Hill is a serious contributor by season’s end. Reed said the “sky is the limit” for the four-star freshman, who could play any number of positions in Patterson’s defensive backfield. “Wherever we can get him on the field fastest, that’s where he’ll be,” Reed said.

10. Safety Christian Pierce is out after offseason surgery. Safety is a critical spot in Patterson’s scheme, and Pierce is one of the most important players on the team. It’d be unfortunate if he had to sit out spring, but I’m bullish on Pierce having a big year regardless.

A sparkly pink electric guitar hangs on a wall of the recording studio where Hilary Duff made her new album. The cozy, gear-filled joint near the Van Nuys Airport belongs to her husband, Matthew Koma, who produced “Luck… or Something,” the singer and actor’s first LP in more than a decade. But as Duff points out on a recent afternoon, the paisley-print guitar is all hers.

“I got it for my 16th birthday,” she says proudly — a gift from the Fender company. “I found it in the storage unit and Matt was like, ‘Oh, that’s going up there.’”

Before Miley Cyrus, before Sabrina Carpenter, before Olivia Rodrigo, Duff arrived in the early 2000s as a Disney kid with pop-idol ambitions. She broke out in the endearingly awkward title role of the Disney Channel’s “Lizzie McGuire” then went on to star in family-friendly movies like “Agent Cody Banks” and “Cheaper by the Dozen.” By the time she received that guitar, she’d topped the Billboard 200 with her album “Metamorphosis,” which sold 4 million copies and spawned hit singles like “So Yesterday” and “Come Clean.”

Duff stepped away from music for most of her 20s to focus on acting and starting a family. (An attempted comeback album in 2015, “Breathe In. Breathe Out.,” didn’t really go anywhere.) Now, at 38, she’s returned with a bracingly honest record full of the texture and detail of her life as a wife, sister and mother of four.

In frank yet wordy songs that layer guitars and synths over shimmering grooves, Duff sings about trying to overcome old habits and about her fear that her best times are behind her. “We Don’t Talk” appears to address her estrangement from her older sister, Haylie, while “Weather for Tennis” describes her tendency to keep the peace as a child of divorce. In “Holiday Party,” she recounts a recurring dream in which Koma cheats on her with her friends.

“I wake up in a rage and he’s like, ‘I didn’t do anything!’” she says with a laugh. “And I’m like, ‘But you want to.’ A lot of this stuff came out of the hormonal boom of: I’ve just had a baby and I’m nursing and I’m trying to get my two feet back on the ground again.” (Duff and Koma have three daughters aged 7, 4 and 1, while Duff shares a 13-year-old son with her ex-husband, former hockey player Mike Comrie.)

Asked how he hopes the album fares commercially, Koma says, “I don’t [care]. Public perception or sales, that’s all cool, but it’s a separate experience from why we did it.” The producer, who’s known for his work with Zedd and Shania Twain, adds, “The whole purpose was to make something that Hilary could feel good about stepping into.”

Yet early-2000s nostalgia led to a recent run of sold-out theater gigs, and this summer it’ll carry her into arenas around the world, including Inglewood’s Kia Forum on July 8 and 9. (Less happily for Duff, it also made a viral sensation of an essay in the Cut by her fellow millennial Ashley Tisdale in which Tisdale wrote about leaving a “toxic mom group” that allegedly included Duff and Mandy Moore.)

Curled on a sofa in the studio’s control room, Duff says, “I’m finally at this place where I’m zero percent ashamed of my past and any of the things that used to embarrass me” — one reason she made the bold choice to open her set at the Wiltern last month with two of her biggest hits, “Wake Up” and “So Yesterday.”

After those songs came “Roommates,” perhaps the most vulnerable track on Duff’s new album. It’s about navigating a dry patch in a marriage, and the language is as vivid as it is unsparing: “I only want the beginning / I don’t want the end,” she sings, adding that she longs to be in the “back of a dive bar, giving you h—.”

A surprising word choice.
How would you have said it? Sometimes you need to make the lyrics fit — you need it to rhyme with something. [Laughs] It’s meant to be polarizing because it’s such a desperate plea. I can say I haven’t actually given h— in the back of a dive bar. But it’s just trying to capture the feeling of a time when you felt alive.

Like all teen stars, you had to figure out how to grow up and talk about sex as a public figure. Now there’s the idea that it’s better left to the young.
I finally feel like I know a lot about sex. My whole 20s, sex was not always enjoyable — it was so much to figure out. Now I finally understand it. Maybe that’s a female thing, but I’m not ready to be put out to pasture. People come up to me all the time and they’re like, “Wow, you aged really well.” I’m like, “I’m only 38! Just because you’ve known me since I was 9…”

You’re handling senior citizenship well.
When do I start getting the discounts? I feel like 38 is not old, although when I thought about my parents at 40, they looked so different than we look now.

I always stop at those TikToks where it shows what 35 looked like in 1982.
I don’t think anyone drank water back then. They were, like, dusty-crusty.

Hilary Duff, left, and Matthew Koma at Apple Music Studios in Los Angeles in December.

(Amy Sussman / Getty Images for Apple Music)

You borrow the chorus of Blink-182’s “Dammit” for your song “Growing Up.” Why?
Blink is one of my favorite bands. I remember getting my driver’s license, and that was what was playing on my iPod. “Growing Up” is such a deeply personal song to me, talking about sitting in the backyard with one of my best friends and just needing to drink too much wine and unload about life. But it also feels like a love letter to my fans. I don’t like saying that word, but I genuinely feel like I’ve had fans for 25 years, and getting to see them now in adulthood — I didn’t know I was going to have this opportunity.

What’s the problem with “fan”?
It puts me on a pedestal that makes me feel uncomfortable. If you were to talk to Matt or someone close to me, they’d probably say, “Hilary doesn’t understand what she’s meant to some people.” And I think that’s true. When I think of myself, I’m not like a grand pop star — I feel more like a woman of the people.

A woman of the people?
Am I allowed to say that? [Laughs] Is that offensive in any way? My feet hit the ground in the morning, and I’ve got a million things to do. Sometimes my baby’s still sleeping. And I have a teenager to get ready for school that we’re always all waiting on.

Why do you have four children?
I know — we’re sick.

Did you expect to have four?
I thought I would have at least three. I always wanted a big family because I come from a super small family and I always wanted more siblings. I had Luca obviously pre-Matt, and then we had Banks before we got married. Then the pandemic hit — we had a pandemic baby like everybody else. The fourth was just a crazy-a— decision. Matt was like, “Everybody’s gonna think we’re really Christ-y if we go for No. 4.” We also have three dogs, two cats and eight chickens.

As two artists, how do you sort out the work of child-rearing?
I don’t know if I’ve actually said this out loud — to Matt I have for sure — but I think that part of my wanting to make a record was coming out of having my fourth child. I love motherhood, obviously — I wouldn’t have four kids if I didn’t. But I think I felt really jealous that he got to go to work every day and just be alone with his thoughts. I was like, I need to stretch. That’s what it felt like after the fourth baby: I’m either gonna lose myself completely and just become a stay-at-home mom and wait for the phone to ring, or I’m gonna go make something that moves me.

You don’t need me to tell you that our culture is always happy to make moms feel guilty. Was it a journey to accept that it’s OK to do something for yourself?
That’s what the healthy part of the brain says. But the other part that’s wired to be with the children you birthed — sometimes that part overshadows it. And it’s very hard to fight that. I could probably cry right now thinking about all the things I’m gonna miss this year.

Hilary Duff in the studio where she recorded her new album.

(Jay L Clendenin / For The Times)

You’ve got a line in “Roommates” where you say, “Life is life-ing and pressure is pressuring me.” At the shows you just played, did you think of your audience as being at the same place in life as you?
For sure. When they were scream-singing it back to me, I was like, “Oh, you know.” That doesn’t mean you have to be a parent. “Life is life-ing” is the bills and the monotony and the traffic and the family — it’s all the things. I knew that if it’s bumping around inside my head, and I’ve been living a pretty normal life for 10 years — normal as I can get — then people would see themselves in it.

Twenty-five years ago, you were playing to 10-year-olds. Would a 10-year-old today be interested in your new songs?
I don’t think so. But I mean, I used to sing Natalie Imbruglia’s “Torn” all the time, and I had no idea what it was about.

The last decade has been a golden age for young female songwriters: Taylor Swift, Billie Eilish, Olivia Rodrigo.
You forgot Chappell Roan.

“Luck… or Something” feels aligned with that deepening craft. But maybe your early stuff felt sophisticated to you.
I don’t think the intent back then was sophisticated songwriting. There was no Taylor Swift yet — it’s like before Christ and after Christ.

She changed the game?
On all the levels.

How’d you end up on Atlantic Records? I wondered whether this was a product of personal friendships — the Elliot Grainge and Sofia Richie and Good Charlotte of it all.
We’re more personally friends with them now. I finished making the record and for the first time ever was like, “It’s done — do you like it?”

You weren’t looking for notes from the label.
I’m not saying I didn’t have meetings with A&R. But pretty much the record was created, and that was that. I didn’t go shopping anywhere else, which was fantastic because I hate a dog-and-pony show.

Did you feel like you’d been chewed up by the record industry in any way?
After “Breathe In. Breathe Out.,” it was very easy to be like, “RCA forced me to lead with this song when I knew it should’ve been this song.” But that was me not having [courage], you know what I mean? It was a joint effort of [messing] it up. But I learned a lot from that. I don’t think I would’ve made this record if I hadn’t fumbled the ball a little.

The story about the toxic mom group blew up just as you were launching this album. Did that experience give you pause about reentering the pop world?
I mean, this is not new for me. I’ve had this since I was maybe 15 and starting to get followed around by paparazzi. Everything starts getting documented and everyone knows my life and all the players in it. So the stories that get news pickup — it’s not what happens to a normal person who maybe became an actor as an adult. And now it’s escalated by the talking heads on TikTok that need clickbait. It’s hard because you’re like, “Wait, whoa, that person kind of got it right,” and “Whoa that person doesn’t know what they’re talking about.” I saw something that was like, “None of the moms at school actually like her and neither do the teachers,” and I was like, “First of all…”

Is it hard or easy for you to tune out —
By the way, the women at school are lovely and I’m obsessed with all of them.

But can you ignore the chatter about you on social media?
It just depends on the day. Knowing that I get to open up the backdoors and play soccer as a family and take a hot tub and go get our chicken eggs — that’s the purpose of life. On the days when crazy s— happens, I go home and quiet the noise.

The most prestigious board ever put together.

That is how the president of the United States, a man convicted of fraud, described his new team focused on international relations. A team that does not include representatives from our closest neighbors — Mexico and Canada — but did save room for leaders accused of war crimes by the International Criminal Court.

Now, we do not know whether President Trump created his “Board of Peace,” which this week held its first meeting, specifically to undermine the authority of the United Nations. But we do know that the president has pledged $10 billion in tax dollars to the board’s mission while still owing the U.N. half that amount in back payments. We do not know whether Trump, who is indefinitely the leader of this peace board, intends to relinquish that power after he leaves the White House. But we do know he is still trying to overturn the results of the 2020 election. Whether the “Board of Peace” is the most prestigious panel ever assembled is debatable. What is not debatable is that it was conceived by an adjudicated sexual abuser who is referenced in the released Epstein files some 38,000 times.

That is not my take.

That is simply what is happening.

Which is why the president encourages his supporters to ban books and reject journalism. He doesn’t want voters to pay attention. He doesn’t want voters to understand his actions.

Ten years ago this month — after his Nevada caucus victory speech — Trump said, “I love the poorly educated.” And his reliance on this base is why, over the past decade, he and other conservatives have purposely misconstrued the term “woke” as a catch-all slur toward progressive and far-left policies. It used to mean “aware” and “informed.” The term was not born out of modern politics but rather the need to understand the history of the social economic systems we all are living in. The alternative is to be blindly led by an unscrupulous leader most concerned with his own well being.

Being “woke” is why the Boston Tea Party happened in 1773; it is why Thomas Paine published “Common Sense” in 1776; it is why Republicans formed the Wide Awakes to help get Abraham Lincoln elected in 1860. When voters understand the context in which decisions are made, we are better equipped to address shortcomings at the ballot box and in our daily lives.

Trump’s self-proclaimed love for the poorly educated has nothing to do with progressive policies or college degrees and everything to do with whom he can convince to believe him. And by making “woke” an insult, Trump and other conservatives have politicized the very tool necessary to help the country fulfill its promise: information.

This threat is the reason his administration attacks, and even arrests, journalists; the reason he refers to reports he doesn’t like as “fake news”; the reason he fired the labor statistics chief after an unflattering jobs report last year. He’s waging a war on information.

The reason 2025 marked the worst nonrecession year for job growth since 2003 isn’t that the country was “woke.” It’s because of shortcomings in leadership.

When Trump returned to the White House, he made lowering the U.S. trade deficit a key component to his economic policy. In 2024, the deficit was $903.5 billion. In 2025, it was $901.5 billion — and America’s families paid $230 billion more for goods because of his yo-yo tariff policies.

He told his supporters that other nations would be paying for the tariffs he enacted — obvious nonsense to anyone who attended a day of Econ 101. And we know that as a result of his reckless and ignorant policies, farmers in particular suffered. It’s not clear whether that financial burden was a consideration when the Supreme Court on Friday declared the president’s sweeping tariffs to be illegal. What we do know is before Trump entered politics, his businesses filed for bankruptcy six times — so perhaps he was never the economic savant he claimed to be.

Just as the saga of the Epstein files reveals he is not the protector of women and young girls that he claimed to be.

Just as his recent attacks on the 1st, 2nd, 4th and 14th Amendments show he was never the defender of the Constitution he took an oath to be.

Acknowledging the laundry list of untruths tied to his promises and presidency is not political or a symptom of “Trump Derangement Syndrome.” It’s simply having information: the one thing that helps voters understand why things are the way they are. The one thing the president hopes his supporters never wake up to see for themselves.

YouTube: @LZGrandersonShow

Welcome to Screen Gab, the newsletter for everyone who is feeling mighty nostalgic about the ’90s and early aughts.

On Thursday night, we learned that Eric Dane died at 53 after a battle with ALS, also known as amyotrophic lateral sclerosis or Lou Gehrig’s disease. The actor was known for his mid-2000s role on ABC’s medical drama “Grey’s Anatomy,” where he earned the moniker “McSteamy” as Dr. Mark Sloan, a plastic surgeon. Coincidentally, yesterday marked the 20th anniversary of his first appearance on “Grey’s.” More recently, he appeared in HBO’s teen drama “Euphoria” as Cal Jacobs, a very complex father to Nate (Jacob Elordi), one of the central characters. The actor will appear posthumously in the show’s third season when it returns in April. Dane remained busy in the past couple of years, having also appeared in the one-season action series “Countdown” on Prime Video and in an episode of ABC’s “Brilliant Minds.” If you want to go further on Dane, Netflix announced this morning that an episode of the docuseries “Famous Last Words” featuring the actor was available. The show consists of an interview with a notable subject, and is only released posthumously.

If you want another trip down memory lane, last week saw the arrival of FX’s “Love Story: John F. Kennedy Jr. & Carolyn Bessette,” which takes a closer look at the famous couple who unexpectedly met a tragic end. The show fully immerses you in the culture of New York in the ’90s, complete with Calvin Klein ads, tabloid magazines with zany headlines and partying at the Roxy nightclub. Connor Hines, the creator of “Love Story,” spoke to us about the show, which you can read below.

Also in this week’s Screen Gab, we recommend an Irish series on Netflix from the creator of “Derry Girls” and another nostalgic docuseries about “America’s Next Top Model.”

ICYMI

Must-read stories you might have missed

Grace Van Patten and Jackson White of “Tell Me Lies” at American Quick Start & Gas Inc. in Brooklyn, N.Y.

(Dutch Doscher / For The Times)

On ‘Tell Me Lies,’ Grace Van Patten and Jackson White’s toxic (onscreen) relationship ends: After three seasons, “Tell Me Lies” comes to an end. Creator Meaghan Oppenheimer unpacks the series finale alongside stars Grace Van Patten and Jackson White.

Missed ‘Scrubs’? They did too, and now they’re back making the rounds: Donald Faison, Zach Braff and Sarah Chalke spoke about reuniting for the revival of the beloved medical comedy created by Bill Lawrence and now helmed by Aseem Batra.

‘Baywatch’ casting call brings back ’90s with in-person auditions, red suits and ripped bods: About 2,000 people flocked to Marina del Rey on Wednesday in hopes of landing a role in the upcoming “Baywatch” reboot, which the production hopes will be a boon for Hollywood.

How ‘The Pitt’ portrayed a rape kit exam sensitively with the help of experts: To portray the exam shown in Episode 7 accurately, the show’s writers and actors consulted with experts from the UCLA Health Rape Treatment Center and Pittsburgh Action Against Rape.

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Recommendations from the film and TV experts at The Times

Bronagh Gallagher, back left, as Booker, Shauna Bray as Midwife, Saoirse-Monica Jackson as Feeney in “How To Get To Heaven From Belfast.”

(Christopher Barr / Netflix)

“How to Get to Heaven From Belfast” (Netflix)

Lisa McGee, whose “Derry Girls” was the toast of 2018, returns with another comedy of Irish women in a mad place. Three friends since school travel to a one-taxi, one-hotel town for the wake of an estranged fourth: Saoirse (Roisin Gallagher), an award-winning television writer who can’t seem to keep her engagement ring on her finger; Robyn (Sinéad Keenan), a busy, bored rich wife and mother; and Dara (Caoilfhionn Dunne), who has been stuck, or has stuck herself, caring for her mother. All share a dark secret they hope to keep buried, but which has begun to poke its head above ground. What, and who, they find, and don’t find, kicks off a manic mystery, served with a side of car trouble, hangovers, a storm, a blackout, oddball supporting characters and a little romance, not necessarily in that order, with sharp, funny dialogue driving it along. And that’s just the beginning. — Robert Lloyd

A still of “America’s Next Top Model” contestants, clockwise from far left, Nicole Panattoni, Adrianne Curry, Elyse Sewell, Kesse Wallace, Robbyne Manning, Giselle Samson, Shannon Stewart and Ebony Haith as featured in “Reality Check: Inside America’s Next Top Model.”

(Courtesy of Netflix)

“Reality Check: America’s Next Top Model” (Netflix)

“We were all rooting for you!” was the cry heard ‘round the world from Tyra Banks, the host and creator of the reality TV series that aimed to find the next fresh face of magazine covers and fashion runways. But viewers learn in this docuseries that what we saw on screen didn’t tell the whole story. From allegations of sexual assault to discord among the judges, “America’s Next Top Model” had a lot of problems, many of them relating to the fact that a show like it hadn’t been done and producers were inexperienced in handling serious issues on set. “Reality Check” features candid interviews with former contestants including Shandi Sullivan, Keenyah Hill, Tiffany Richardson (recipient of that famous “rooting” speech) and Banks herself. — Maira Garcia

Guest spot

A weekly chat with actors, writers, directors and more about what they’re working on — and what they’re watching

Sarah Pidgeon as Carolyn Bessette Kennedy and Paul Kelly as John F. Kennedy Jr. in “Love Story: John F. Kennedy Jr. & Carolyn Bessette.”

(FX)

The latest anthology series produced by Ryan Murphy dramatizes the true-life romance between John F. Kennedy Jr. and Carolyn Bessette that gripped the culture in the ’90s. Nearly three decades after their tragic deaths, FX’s “Love Story” revisits the tumultuous seven-year relationship between the pair. JFK Jr. (Paul Anthony Kelly) spent his life navigating the public spotlight as the son and namesake of an assassinated (and beloved) president, and Bessette (Sarah Pidgeon) was a publicist working at Calvin Klein. Inspired by Elizabeth Beller’s book “One Upon a Time: The Captivating Life of Carolyn Bessette-Kennedy,” the nine-episode series chronicles the couple’s whirlwind romance and their struggle to maintain their relationship under intense media scrutiny before their deaths in a 1999 plane crash. The first four episodes are streaming now on Hulu and Disney+, with new episodes released weekly on Thursdays. Connor Hines, who created the series, stopped by Guest Spot to discuss what intrigued him about the couple’s plight and the early aughts rom-com that he admires. — Yvonne Villarreal

You were a child when the love story of John F. Kennedy Jr. and Carolyn Bessette — as well as that fateful flight — generated intense media attention. What do you remember about their story? What stood out then?

My father commuted into Manhattan every day for work and always brought home the New York Post. I have vivid memories of seeing photos of them splashed across the cover. I knew about the Kennedy family, of course, but I couldn’t fully grasp the choke hold John F. Kennedy Jr. had on the country at the time. The scale of the fascination was something I only truly understood later.

Why does this story feel worth revisiting now? And did any modern couples in the spotlight become reference points as you unpacked questions about public fascination while weaving together this story?

We’re living in an attention economy, so a couple beset by obsession and scrutiny feels especially resonant right now. There are, unfortunately, far too many examples of women who marry high-profile figures only to be harangued for expressing anything other than gratitude and graciousness. That dynamic hasn’t disappeared — it’s simply evolved.

The series grapples with the media invasion that swirled around them. Some critics contend that dramatizing their story for television reignites it. How do you see it? And how did that inform your approach to telling this story?

They’ve been memorialized as these beautiful, one-dimensional fashion figures whose marriage buckled under immense pressure. The series felt like an opportunity to course-correct a dated and misogynistic narrative, especially surrounding Carolyn — and to add dimension to two people who were far more complex than the images and tabloid stories written about them.

You seemingly had a lot of material to draw from and public moments in their relationship timeline to focus on. What was a moment that most fascinated you?

I was personally drawn to Carolyn’s rich life before she became a public figure. She was incredibly sharp, savvy and dynamic — she ascended from folding sweaters at a Calvin Klein store in the mall to becoming a muse and trusted advisor to Calvin Klein himself. I don’t think people fully appreciate how much she gave up to be with John.

What have you watched recently that you are recommending to everyone you know?

“Dying for Sex” [Hulu, Disney+]. “Adolescence” [Netflix].

What’s your go-to “comfort watch,” the movie or TV show you go back to again and again?

“Something’s Gotta Give” [Tubi], or anything by Nora Ephron. I’m also an unapologetic champion of the Bravo network.

Not only is Betye Saar a living legend, but the prolific L.A. artist continues to add to her impressive oeuvre day by day.

She’s been creating powerful, thought-provoking artwork since the ’60s and her pieces have been shown at the Smithsonian, the Museum of Modern Art, the Art Institute of Chicago and LACMA, as well as museums and galleries around the world.

In Sunday Funday, L.A. people give us a play-by-play of their ideal Sunday around town. Find ideas and inspiration on where to go, what to eat and how to enjoy life on the weekends.

As her centennial birthday approaches this July, Saar shows no signs of slowing down. She still routinely creates art and continues to garner headlines and accolades. Last year, she was honored with the distinction of “Icon Artist” at the Art Basel Awards. During the upcoming Frieze Los Angeles art festival, which opens Feb. 26, she will be the subject of the photography installation “Betye Saar Altered Polaroids.” And this May, “Let’s Get It On: The Wearable Art of Betye Saar” will debut at Roberts Projects, the gallery that represents her. The exhibition will feature pieces from her early career as a costume and jewelry designer.

Though she’s skilled at painting and photography, she’s most widely known for assemblage, the art of juxtaposing miscellaneous items to form a single cohesive work. Her dioramas, sculptures and large-scale multimedia installations explore the legacy of American slavery, confront racial injustice and celebrate the strength and resiliency of African American women.

“I work with found objects that had another purpose before they came to my hands,” Saar says while seated at a patio table in her succulent-filled tiered garden. “The hardest part of it is going to a flea market, secondhand stores, an estate sale or even just going behind a store to see what people throw away.”

Over the years, she’s traveled by plane, train and automobile in search of usable materials. Meanwhile, admirers, colleagues and gallery workers have sent her curios from New Mexico, Tennessee, New England and beyond. Her daughters — artists Alison and Lezley, and writer Tracye, their mother’s studio director — also stay on the lookout for objects that might catch her eye.

“I’ve been doing this for a long time, so I have quite a collection,” she says.

Indeed, Saar’s multi-level home studio in Laurel Canyon is bursting with dozens of old empty picture frames, discarded window panes, wooden chests, antique chairs and vintage clocks. But there’s always room for more.

Her idea of a perfect Sunday includes foraging for new items (or old ones, as the case may be) to use in her daily art practice. And she’d return to her roots to do it.

“Pasadena is my hometown and I still have a few relatives that live there,” she says.

While visiting her old stomping grounds, she’d embark on a multi-stop shopping spree and wander through a longtime favorite San Gabriel Valley attraction (where her work just so happens to be on display).

This interview has been lightly edited and condensed for length and clarity.

10 a.m.: Search for hidden treasures

Pasadena Community College Flea Market is something that’s part of “the hunt.” Alison usually drives, sometimes Tracye. Some people are there early to get the deals; we’re not like that anymore. I like to look around and sometimes I find interesting fabrics, scarves to wear and strange-shaped succulents for my garden. I hardly ever find really good antiquing things there, because those are at antique stores and they’re usually pretty pricey. But I bought an old, rusty metal birdcage the seller said was from France. I like rusty stuff for my art. I also found an indigo blue kimono to wear at an art event later this year.

1 p.m.: Replenish with Thai food

I’d go down Fair Oaks Avenue — there’s some secondhand stores. Usually, it’s nothing I can use, but I still can’t say no. I have to go see for myself. Then, lunch at Saladang Garden. I always order chicken sate and the green papaya salad. Last time I went, we tried the Thai corn fritter which was really good and crispy. If food is too spicy, I can’t eat it. But somebody in my party would always have something spicy and I can have a spoonful to add to mine.

2:30 p.m.: More shopping

I am attracted to all the odd things at Gold Bug. Notepads and trinkets, curious vintage-y things with animals or interesting patterns, strange candles. Sometimes I surprise myself by buying something. They have a mixture of things that — whether it’s for the color, or the texture — I feel that I can recycle and fit into an art object that I’m making.

3:30 p.m.: Visit a childhood haunt (with a side of more shopping)

I really like the Huntington’s gardens. I remember the first time I went there was with my mother and a friend of hers, and we walked around. All the paths were dirt, you know, they hadn’t even gotten around to paving it yet. But I just fell in love with it. And I really like their gift shop.

6 p.m.: Head west for a culinary classic

If I go someplace to eat for lunch, I usually have leftovers to warm up. Nothing wrong with leftovers — if you liked it the first time, you’ll like it again! But if I had to go out to dinner, the Apple Pan. I would go there in the ’80s with my daughters. I like their sandwiches, or the hickory burger with cheese, and there’s good French fries.

8 p.m.: Tuck into some wind-down watching

Before bed, I like to watch the news because, otherwise, I don’t know what’s going on. I also like a lot of shows on PBS. “Finding Your Roots,” or dramas like “Sister Boniface Mysteries” and “Call the Midwife,” which has been going on forever!

In this episode of The Envelope video podcast, Teyana Taylor describes the “slingshot” of success that’s come with “One Battle After Another” and shares her insights as to why fictional revolutionary Perfidia Beverly Hills does what she does in the film.

Kelvin Washington: Hello, everyone, and welcome back to The Envelope. Kelvin Washington, Yvonne Villarreal, we have Mark Olsen as well. Hopefully you all have been great since the last time I saw you. Everybody been good?

Mark Olsen: Of course.

Washington: Well, I tell you what, there’s a list of folks who’ve been very good because they’ve been nominated for an Oscar. And obviously, you kind of get the usual suspects, if you will. And then you get some surprises out there. Some folks you go, “Whoa!” So I want to start with you. Either of you can jump in on this. Is there someone that maybe surprised you, a film or something that you were just excited about or maybe someone said, “Them again?” or “That film again?”

Olsen: I think it was very exciting that “Sinners” got the most nominations of any film ever with 16 nominations. It was nominated in every category that it was eligible for. To see a movie that has had commercial success and felt like a cultural moment now being recognized somewhere like the Academy Awards, it’s just exciting to see that all coming together and rolling along for that film, regardless of how it turns out at the show.

Villarreal: I was very excited to see Rose Byrne get acknowledged for “If I Had Legs I’d Kick You.” Because I was worried about that movie losing steam after all the raves it got at Sundance [in 2025] and it’s a smaller movie. I wasn’t sure, “Are people going to remember it?” But I just think she’s so great in that film.

I was sort of surprised that Chase Infiniti didn’t get nominated.

Olsen: Because of the nature of the movie, the whole lead/supporting business was tough, and also it being her first movie, it’s a little harder to get that nomination — especially in lead actress, faced with, say, Kate Hudson, someone who’s been in the business for a long time, is much beloved in the industry, has obviously family historical ties to Hollywood. It’s interesting to see even in the nominations this sort of alchemy of like, “a little of this, a little bit of that” as far as who the academy was choosing to recognize.

Washington: You know, I go back to something you said, Mark, when you go to “Sinners.” You mentioned the blockbuster feel of it, getting people’s butts to the theaters, spending money. And also kind of original. We’ve had vampire movies before, but, you know, you get the “Transformer 12’s” and “Expendable 32’s.” I think a lot of folks were excited to see something original that also had commercial success as well.

Another film that had a bunch of success is “One Battle After Another.” You had a chance to speak with a star from that film, who’s been a star in her own right musically, but now into the film world, with Teyana Taylor.

Olsen: That’s right. It’s so exciting. She’s nominated for best supporting actress. This is a long movie, it’s over two and a half hours long. She more or less exits the picture about 30 minutes in. So I think it says something about the strength of her performance that her character kind of hovers over the rest of that movie. You feel her in the movie, even though she’s actually not onscreen. So at the Oscar nominees luncheon recently, we had a chance to sit down with Teyana and she was just so vibrant, so full of energy, really has a great attitude about this moment for herself. I mean, she just recently won a Golden Globe, she hosted “Saturday Night Live.” So much is like happening for her, seemingly right now and she’s just got this real like, taking it all in, very open to it [attitude]. It was really an exciting conversation.

Washington: A culmination of all her hard work. Here is Mark’s conversation with Teyana Taylor.

Teyana Taylor.

(Ian Spanier / For The Times)

Mark Olsen: You were just at the Super Bowl. About a week before that, you were a nominee at the Grammys. About a week before that you hosted “Saturday Night Live.” About a week before that you won a Golden Globe. And you’re here today as an Academy Award nominee. I’m sure I’m leaving some things out. I would say what’s the last year been like for you, but I feel like, what’s the last month or two been like for you? It feels like the rocket ship has really taken off.

Teyana Taylor: Yeah, it’s really taken off. I’m so blessed and I’m so honored and I’m filled with so much gratitude to just see so many prayers get answered all at once, where I’m also OK with one at a time. But it’s all happening, you know? And I’m just beyond blessed. And like we were talking about earlier, just how much fun I’m having with it. I’m really having a good time and I’m taking it all in because life is short and life is so fragile. So I just try and take time to enjoy life and enjoy my blessings and enjoy just being alive and well.

Olsen: Has there been a moment that felt the most surreal, like a “What is happening to me right now” moment?

Taylor: Honestly, all of it, because it reminds me of a slingshot, you know what I’m saying? It’s just like, here’s the way, here’s the way, here’s the way, here’s the way, here’s the work, here’s the prayers, here’s the tears, just here, here, here, here, here. And then whoosh — whatever the ball hit, it knocked down everything at once. And that’s what this feels like. It feels really good because literally everything is happening at the same time. So it’s not like only one moment or only two moments that’s making me feel this way. It’s everything. The small wins, the big wins, the medium wins. Every single win and every single blessing is a big deal to me. You know what I’m saying? Even my Ls. I’m not gonna win everything and I’m not gonna get everything, and some things are not even meant for me. But even those are blessings. It’s preparation for something that is in store for me and something that is meant for me, because all of this is already written. What’s for you is for you and will be for you, because that’s just what’s written. So I have that mindset.

Olsen: You’ve been doing this since you were a teenager, at first as a choreographer and a dancer, a singer, an actor, you’re going to direct your first feature soon. What keeps you moving through all of this, through these different disciplines and pursuits?

Taylor: My babies. My support system. My village. My community. I love to make my people proud. I love to make my peers proud, my family. I just love to make everybody proud and that’s what keeps me going. Even right now, I’m also in culinary school. So it’s just juggling that, but taking out the little moments to just be quiet and cook and feed my people. So it’s a push. It’s understanding it’s a marathon and that it’s not a sprint. It’s a part of the faith walk. And I think that’s what keeps me going, to wake up and feel so blessed, how could I ever complain? How could I ever be like, “Oh, this is too much”? It is everything I’ve ever asked for. I’m never going to complain about answered prayers. What pushes me is just the reassurance from my support system, the reassurance from Father God himself, the reassurance for my babies. They keep me going. That’s who I do it for. I want to create generational wealth. So them babies are my reason. They are my why.

Olsen: To start asking you about “One Battle After Another,” your character, Perfidia Beverly Hills, she’s inspired a lot of conversation and some controversy. For you, was there something about that character that you felt you hadn’t seen on screen before?

Taylor: Yes. Perfidia is complex and she is also misunderstood. This is a woman who has been in survival mode, who has been fetishized, who has been ignored, not seen. We’re seeing this woman deal with that, where in movies we’re used to seeing us women have to be in capes all day and you see this woman rip this cape away and it’s just unapologetically herself — even in her weakness. And even like you said, with the controversy of her sexuality, I think her sexuality is her armor. It is also her power. She’ll give somebody what they want to get what she wants. And literally in the movie, she’s made selfish decisions. But if you think about her spirit and mentally and emotionally as a woman, it felt good to see a woman actually be selfish and put her[self] first, which we never really get to do because we have to be super this, super this, super this. Super mom, super wife, super woman, super chef; everything is always with a super in front of it. And you see this woman not really caring about what people think. Nobody can quiet her. And in this space of, “OK, you’re too loud, quiet down; you stand too tall, have a seat,” Perfidia is all of the things that they can’t make her do. She’s like, “I’m gonna stand tall, I’m gonna use my voice, I’m gonna use whatever I need to use to get what I want.” And she makes decisions that we don’t agree with, but I think one thing we all can agree on is that she’s a badass. And I can always respect anybody that’s unapologetically themselves.

Another thing that I feel like the controversy is proof of is how much of a nonfactor postpartum depression is. Half of the mistakes we see Perfidia make is her dealing with postpartum depression. You see the moment where they say, “Perfida, she’s a runner. She comes from a long line of revolutionaries.” That in itself is a pressure on her to feel like she gotta keep that going. The revolution is instilled in her. It’s a part of her identity. So imagine getting pregnant and you’re feeling like, “Oh, my God, does this slow down the revolution? Am I gonna play house with a person that’s ignoring me?” Nobody is really taking the time to think about what’s happening in her mind. We can’t control how a person handles postpartum depression. We hear her, through the door, cry, and then we see Bob put his ear to the door — and instead of him walking in, he walked away. And then what was the result of that? Her walking away. Even if it had to be walking away from Baby Willa, it’s something that she felt like she needed to do, and that’s what postpartum make you do sometime. And every mother handles postpartrum depression differently. But I think that’s what I love about her character, because you get to see a harsh reality that I know is hard to take in. But when you watch it a few times you understand exactly what’s happening. … I think that’s what makes the letter at the end so important. Because you hear the pain, you hear the hurt, you hear the regret, you hear the accountability, “Do you have love? Are you happy? Will you try and change the world like we did? We failed, but maybe you will not.”

And that’s another thing. This is a story that Paul Thomas Anderson wanted to tell. It was Perfidia’s job to go and anchor this boat and stay there and create the path for Willa to take on these battles, because her past haunted Willa and Bob. That’s a part of Perfidia being supporting — supporting the next steps of what is for Willa. It’s for Willa to go on and to rise. So you see Perfidia in the beginning of the movie, you see her drive this boat, you see her get to the middle of the sea and you see her anchor herself. And from there, we have to continue the story. So I’m happy that the controversy around her can create dialogue like this, can create healthy dialogue or even uncomfortable dialogue. As long as it’s dialogue and we’re conversing and we are speaking and people are speaking from their point of views, I can absolutely respect that.

Olsen: Is that a conversation you expected to have? When you were making the film, were you and Paul, or you and your co-stars talking about the depiction of Black women in the movie? Or have you been surprised that’s been such a talking point now that the movie’s out in the world?

Taylor: Honestly, I’m not surprised of any of the talking. I think one thing that I said before the movie even dropped and we were doing our press junkets, I was always very boisterous about the fact that this movie, period, not just the character, would definitely shake the table, and it would definitely spark, whether it was great debates or — I love conversation and I like when we can converse. Get it off your chest, tell me how you feel. And I’m open to receive that. So I knew that it would shake the table. I also knew that it needed to be done. Postpartum depression is a big thing for me that I feel like it needs more light. It needs light around it. We need more solutions for it. And like I said, you see this person, this woman in survival mode. You see this woman be ignored. You see this woman be fetishized. And is that not the truth? Is that not what happens, especially in this place of a Black woman feeling the least protected? So I’m really happy that Paul put wings on that to be able to spread and fly with that. And like I said, I know it’s probably tough to take in, but that’s what we got to see because everybody is not wearing capes. Everybody is not handling things the way you may handle things, I may handle the things, the way that person or this person may handle things. So we all just got to give grace and take in the film. It’s a story that’s being told.

Olsen: To me, one of the biggest surprises about the movie is considering how cohesive and complete it feels, to learn how improvisatory and collaborative the process of making the movie was. Were you surprised by that? What was it like for you entering into the process of making this movie with Paul?

Taylor: I was shocked at how collaborative it was. And I loved every bit of it because one thing about it is, again, when you are telling a story that someone wrote — he’s been working on this project for 20 years. This is something that I consider to be his baby. And when you’re trusting me to take on a job like this, I don’t ever wanna walk into any set and feel like I’m doing what I want to do. I just want to be of good support. If you tell me, “Hey, let’s find this together,” I’m gonna find it together. If you say, “This is my vision of what that is and this is how I want it to be,” it’s my job to give you that vision of what you want it be, and then add my little sauce on top of it. But to be fully collaborative, I thought it was really dope. We found Perfidia’s layers and we color-coordinated those layers. And I’m really happy that he let me be a part of that.

Olsen: What do you feel you brought to Perfidia or you were able to add to the character?

Taylor: I was able to add a lot. Paul was very, very collaborative. And again, we found her layers, which was the most important, especially with such a complex character. And you know, I just came from “A Thousand and One.” So I came from being another complex character, but this one was complex to a whole other level, where we almost didn’t understand why we never see Perfidia cry. But you see these little moments, like little details, in her face that’s just like, it’s this strength, but the strength — because I also don’t really love the term “strong Black woman” — it’s this strength that you feel like she has to have because the strength is really survival mode. And again, like I said, you hear her crack down and you hear her vulnerable, and nobody stepped through that door. So when you see a strong Black woman, there is no grace, it’s, “Oh, she’s OK, she fine, she got it all figured out.” And then you hear her vulnerable and you still feel like even at her most vulnerable, she got this, she’s strong. And it’s just like, “Step through the door. Step in early. Step in the first time. Hear me the first time, see me [this] time, wipe the first tear away. Would she have walked out that door on Baby Willa and Bob, had he walked through that door when he heard her cry?

Olsen: I’ve heard you a number of times when you’re talking about Paul, you always call him Paul “Let Him Cook” Thomas Anderson. What does that mean?

Taylor: Let him cook! Listen, because he to me is a master chef. And honestly, I’m very, very big on leadership. I respect the person that is a leader. What makes it so dope is because, with being in culinary school, I originally signed up for culinary school, of course, to learn the art of culinary, but to just cook, I love to cook and I wanted to learn the art of that. With being enrolled in culinary school, it’s a lot of writing work and a lot of discussion forums and a lot of quizzes and stuff like that. So you’re not only learning to cook, but you’re learning how to run a business. You’re learning how to navigate your staff, front of house, back of house, in the kitchen. You have to understand it’s a whole system in how you handle people in general. In the kitchen they call it like a “servant leader,” where your leader is in the kitchen with you, they’re cooking with you. They’re your mentor, they are your guidance, but they’re cooking with you. They’re not just pointing, “Do this, do that, boom, boom, boom.” And it’s just, like, his gentle servant leadership is something that I respect so much and something that inspires me as an upcoming movie director on how to handle and navigate my staff.

So it’s like the best of both worlds because I have PTA and then I have culinary school who’s teaching me how to be the best leader. Even in how we handle people, it’s bigger than just the people that work for us or with us. It’s also the people that come into this restaurant. It’s your customers. It’s just the hospitality of it all and the hospitality that he gives, it’s really amazing to see. I’m also a big sports girl. So even in regards to him being our quarterback, you know, he’s not on the side, pointing at what to do. He’s on the field with you. But he has an even bigger job because now he’s trusting that he’s going to throw this ball to you and you’re going to receive that ball. So we’re his receivers, we’re his wide receivers to take it to the touchdown. It’s all about being present. And that’s what I learned in culinary, it’s what I learned in sports, it’s just everything about being a leader as I prepare to lead my village and lead my community. That’s just so important to me. So I always respect people that are in the field with you. I become a warrior for you. You see Paul, you’re running in the battlefield, you look to your left, he’s with you. He’s not on a horse, he’s not on his high horse. He’s in the field with you. Let’s go, we got this! And it just makes you want to you want to go so hard for him. And that’s how I look at it. So I am a student. I am a teammate. I am a soldier. I am a warrior. That’s what I am with people that are great leaders.

Olsen: When you won the Golden Globe, your speech was so moving and you specifically spoke to your “brown sisters and little brown girls” and said that their light does not need permission to shine. Can you talk more about that? What was it that made you want to say that in that moment, specifically talking about this movie?

Taylor: I thought it was a very important moment on a very important stage. I wanted to use my voice and I wanted to use my platform. And in that moment, I had the voice and the platform to say just that. It’s nothing less than that. There’s nothing beyond that. Exactly what I said. We deserve space. What that night showed was that here’s the space. And I appreciated that. I was filled with so much gratitude. That moment hit hard for me because I was that little girl that sat on the floor on a TV watching the other queens onstage accept their awards. Like, “You can do it too, you can do it too.” And I knew that one day when it was my turn, I would tell my little queens, “You can do it too — all the little queens that look like me, you can do it too, you deserve space.” To know that also my daughters were watching as well, it’s everything to me. It’s everything for me to know that they embrace that as well. It’s so important. I’ve gotten so many women come up to me like, “Wow, that speech was just everything.” And that’s what it’s all about. That’s what is all about: to inspire, uplift and remind us that there is space.

Olsen: Before I let you go, you just bring it on red carpets time and time again. And the one thing I like is that you wear these really bold outfits, and it never looks like the clothes are wearing you. Do you have tips for people? What do you do for confident personal style?

Taylor: Honestly, follow your heart. Follow your heart. If you see it and you like it, put it together. You might put it together and be like, “That didn’t work the way I [intended].” Practice. Play in clothes. I love to play in clothes — but also will walk in the store and redress a whole mannequin. I’ll also be like, “I like that tie, I think it should be a little bit tighter.” I dream about certain outfits. I dream of certain moments where I’m like, “Oooh. I already know what I feel like I want my Oscar dress to look like. I already know what I want my Golden Globes dress to look like.” It’s always a vision. Or sometimes you might have a base. You might see something and be like, “I like this, but I feel it could use this.” Add it. If you feel like something can use something, add it. Because before you know it, now you done created your own thing. So don’t hesitate. When I was younger, I used to hesitate and be like, “This looked pretty cool, but now I’m not gonna do it.” And then later on, I see somebody try it, and I’m like, “Oh, I should have just…” Always follow your gut and always follow you heart.

Ryan Sickler is used to asking the question that people are afraid to ask: “Is there anyone here who has ever actually died and come back and would be comfortable talking about it in front of all of us?”

It’s not your typical comedy show crowd work but it has profound results. During his special “Ryan Sickler: Live & Alive” released on YouTube in October, a woman in the audience talked about a near-death experience as a child where she rode her bicycle in front of a neighbor’s station wagon. But Sickler pointed out that this remarkable level of candor in the audience is something he continues to marvel about. In fact, he said they did two shows the night they taped his special and during the second show two people in the crowd said they had near-death experiences.

“When I ask the question, I know there’s someone in the crowd that’s like, ‘There’s nobody in here that’s died and come back,’” Sickler said. “So now they’re all very excited to listen too. Like, what happened to this lady, or what happened to this guy? You know, there’s been some wild ones, some real funny ones out there too.”

Given how many comedy specials are being released on various streaming platforms, he says that “we have lost the specialness of the special.” But Sickler said since coming so close to death and being able to talk about it with candor and relatability, he is still calling his latest self-produced YouTube special, special. It now has more than 1 million views on YouTube. Sickler has been on the comedy scene for more than 30 years and released his comedy special “Lefty’s Son” in 2023. He also hosts the “HoneyDew Podcast.” His comedy career has often incorporated his lived experience with a rare blood-clotting disease called Factor V Leiden that almost killed him.

But these days, he’s grateful to be alive, to have been able to wake up when it looked like he might not, to watch his daughter continue to grow up and the laughs along the way. Sickler has long been candid about his chronic health issues with his comedy but he has found particular meaning in doing crowd work when he performs, that talks about death and what it means to live.

The Times recently spoke with Sickler about his special and how he thinks about his sense of health, humor and mortality.

Ryan Sickler in the studio where he films the “HoneyDew Podcast.”

(Al Seib / For The Times)

What did you want to say this time around in your new special?

My first special was something that was a bit of a hybrid of stuff that had been out there and around, but I didn’t own it. It was out there on people’s platforms. They’re making the money off of it. And so I did a bit of, “Let me get this stuff on my channel where I can control it.” And then the other part of that special was becoming a new single dad, all those things this time, specifically, I really just wanted to talk about what had happened and the results after that. I follow these comedy accounts and in October, there were 31 stand-up specials that hit between Netflix, Hulu, YouTube. November was 30. This month was a little slow because the holidays, but it was still at 18 the last time I checked. So I don’t think there’s anything special about stand-up specials anymore. You’re in an environment now where there’s a stand-up special a day, people are doing that with podcasts. There’s so much content going on out there, and I feel like a lot of it is the same. So I this time wanted to just take something that happened very personal to me, this incident, and then tell the story, not only behind it, but what happened after and I was really proud of being able to just focus on that and make that into this special instead of just my observations on this or my thoughts on that. I’m a storyteller and I really think that’s what art is.

When did you realize you had the courage to write about this near–death experience?

I know I had the courage to write about it a long time ago. When I’m making people laugh at my father’s funeral and things like that, I knew I was comfortable being able to take on the material. But what I didn’t know was, could I make it funny? Could I make it relatable? Could I make this one thing that happened to this one person on this rock in outer space matter to anybody and make them care? Because it’s not like we all had this happen to us. This is just one thing that happened to this one dude. So that was really what I was more worried about, is like, can I get this message across and make it relatable, funny and entertaining at the same time? Which is why I threw in those really expensive light cues.

It can be very challenging to hear about these traumatic [near–death] experiences that people have had. How do you absorb that and not absorb it too much?

I’ve been doing this show for so long that it does start to wear on you a little bit hearing a lot of the trauma. So I created a new podcast a couple years ago called the Wayback, which is just fun, funny, nostalgia. So that also for me, was like, let’s not dig into the tears and let’s just laugh about growing up. So that was one way where I could still keep it in my lane and do my job, where I alleviate that a little bit. But the other thing, and I make fun of myself a little, is I’m like the paramedic at the party now. I’m the guy that’s like “You think that’s bad, wait until you hear this.” “This one guy …” “This one lady …” You know what I mean? So I’ve almost become sort of their voice, and I have absorbed it in a way that isn’t so negative, where I carry it home with me. I always forget the quote how it’s worded, but it’s something to the tune of, if we all stood in a circle and threw our problems in the middle, we’d all take our shit right back. It’s like you know what, that’s what you’re dealing with? I’m gonna go ahead and take mine.

How is hearing all these stories and connecting with the crowd and fans in this way [about near–death experiences] changed how you think about your own sense of mortality?

Even with my close call, like, that one angered me, because you start to think about things. You never know how you’re really going to go. You might have an idea if you’re getting older and cancer runs in your family, whatever, but the fact that you could go to a hospital for a simple surgery, they don’t listen to you, everything’s there in your paperwork. You’re your own advocate. You’re doing all the right stuff by yourself, and you’re among professionals, medical professionals, not Yahoos, and you can still have someone else make a mistake and your life is gone. That started me thinking a lot like, “Oh man, for no fault of my own, I could also be gone.” So I go day by day, and I try to be happy day by day. And I’m not going to lie, I also like to know I got a little something tomorrow too.

Do you think that incorporating death and near–death in your comedy helps people work through their own feelings about death and grief?

I only say yes to that because the amount of emails I get, the amount of feedback we get, the amount of guests that still continue to show up [to support] the Patreon. I’ve definitely found, I would say, a purpose in my people. If you’re someone saying you’re a jerk for laughing at this lady talking about cancer, we’re not laughing at her cancer. We’re laughing at something, some light that she found in the darkness of this and trying to have a moment here together, all about, “Hey, there’s some positive ways to look at things at your lowest.” So I know it’s helped people. I mean, we have, over the years, probably thousands of emails now. We have people telling us how much it’s helped. And I mean just through podcasting, I found out I have this blood disease. I was 42 at the time, and already been podcasting. There’s a lady I went to high school with. She’s like “Ryan, my son is 17. He started clotting.” I said, “Go ahead and check for this.” He listens to the podcast. This kid has it. I said, “Well, bad news. It’s genetic.” Now the whole family’s got to get tested. And if you have it from one parent, it’s not great, but having it from two is bad. The whole family gets tested. The parents have it. She’s got it from both her parents. So I can’t get over the fact that a woman I knew when we were children, 35 years later is like, “Hey, that thing you’re talking about on your podcast, my kids, my family, we all have it.” And then I’ve talked about another disease I also have, called Charcot-Marie-Tooth disease, which is CMT. And from bringing that up, people hit me up on that like “I have it, no one ever talks about that.”

What have you found to be one of the positives — besides surviving — of your near–death experience?

Gosh, so many. I have a child, so getting to see her grow and really taking care of my health and things. Not that I wasn’t before, but just I dove in even deeper. I went and got what’s called a gallery test for prescreening for cancer. I started doing all these blood works and like, “Let’s go find out everything you know, because I didn’t find out that I had this blood disease until I was 42 when I clotted.” I’m living my whole life, not even knowing I have this thing and and if I don’t clot, there are plenty of people out there that live to 100 years old and have it. It’s really made me appreciate life and trying to take things day by day. I also was living in a little single-dad pad at the time. We had no central air. We had tandem parking. We were above dumpsters. Our laundry was outside in a room with quarters. And when I got home — I’m still on a walker — and I was like, “What are we doing? We’re going to die without central air? Are we going to die with a bucket of quarters on the fridge? No more.” And so I moved my home, I moved my studio, I did all these things that are, like, the biggest thing you can do in life. We’re going to roll the dice, scared money don’t win, and we’re just going to go for it. Also, as a comedian and anybody in entertainment will tell you, a lot of times you work scared, you hold that money and you wait until the next thing comes. And also, as a single parent, you know we got to budget. And I was like, no more. We’re not going to go out and buy 10 Porsches. We’re going to be responsible. But I was on point with let’s go get a living will and trust. Let’s make sure we have that life insurance policy. Let’s make sure we have all the proper paperwork and stuff done before we do anything like go on a vacation, you know, let’s get this done now and get it done proper.

What do those conversations look like, if you have them at all, about encouraging your male friends to go to the doctor or encouraging them to take care of themselves, physically and emotionally?

I would say the conversations go something like this. My younger brother is like, “Hey, man, I just went in for a test, and they’re telling me I got to have an old school triple bypass,” and then that’s what we all get tested. “Hey guys, I found I got a blood disease.” “Oh man, we all better look into it now.” That’s usually how it goes. I don’t know many men who are proactive. There are a few of us these days. But it’s usually something horrible happens and then we’ll be proactive about everything else.

Do you have male fans who also say “I [saw] your special … I went to your show, and it made me go [to the doctor]”?

Yeah, but I’m saying, though, it still took them to come see a professional clown to get them to go to the damn doctor. I actually have been very good about going, because everyone in my family died. So I’ve been proactive in the sense that I go get two physicals a year. I’ve been doing that since my 20s. I always tell my doctor, if I can go buy expensive sushi, if I go buy weed, if I go buy all these things, I can put money into myself here and come see you a second time and pay for all that. So I do two physicals a year, and I’ve been doing that forever. But I’ve never done any sort of like gallery test. And now we’re in our 50s, so we got to go get the prostate and all that. That’s when you start hearing about that stuff. There’s a lot of ignorance that goes into it as well. I just had a guest here on the “HoneyDew” and said he didn’t go to a doctor or anything for over 20 years because he was just scared of what they were going to tell him. He was scared to get the bad news. You can kind of get the bad news and you could turn that into good news. It doesn’t need to be deadly news.

How do you know when you’ve been too open?

It usually tends to be a personal thing where someone’s like, “I don’t really appreciate you bringing that up.” So I don’t anymore. I’m always cognizant of [saying] like, “Hey, would it be cool if I talked about this or whatever?” I feel like the question you’re asking me would have been great for me just before I started, like, the “HoneyDew” and stuff because this is what I really want to talk about. Everyone wants to talk about the best and bring their best and I just really do want to hear about, you know, the trauma bond. I want to hear about the worst times in your life. I want to know because, honestly, that tells me so much more about you than you verbally talking about you. You know who you were in those moments, how you reacted, how you behaved, how you’ve adjusted. Those things really end up defining who you are, and that’s more what I want to know about. I don’t want to know your best polished version of yourself.

The late afternoon sun was setting over Coldwater Canyon when the bus arrived. Students from Boyle Heights’ Bravo High spilled out into TreePeople, a nature reserve and nonprofit in Coldwater Canyon Park, and took off hiking.

As they looked around the sage and monkeyflower-lined path, their chatter quieted, and soon, they were writing poetry.

Alina Sadibekova, a junior at the magnet medical school, sat under native oak trees, breathing in the soil-rich air with a pen in hand.

“Our city is very busy, especially living in L.A. where everything just goes on and on and it feels like there’s never a point where we can take a breath,” Alina said. “Going to the parks helped me ground myself.”

During a field trip to Gabrielino Springs and the L.A. River Gardens, Bravo High School students from Feng Shui Poetry in the Parks work on poems inspired by the landscape.

(Genesis Sierra)

TreePeople, is one of many green spaces she has visited with Feng Shui Poetry in the Parks, a program dreamed up by the West Hollywood poet laureate, Jen Cheng, in partnership with Bravo High English teacher Steve “Mr. V” Valenzuela. Cheng’s aim is for poetry, nature and Chinese principles to inspire a love for nature in students otherwise surrounded by concrete.

“I think as humans, we’re part of nature, so being better connected to nature actually brings you more home to yourself,” Cheng said. She explains that feng shui, the ancient Chinese practice of arranging a space to encourage harmony, is based on five natural elements: water, wood, fire, earth and metal.

“Feng shui, in poetry, is a lens that you can use to process big ideas using your surroundings,” Cheng said. “You can say, ‘Let’s write about water running down a river,’ not literally, but maybe as a metaphor for migration.”

Feng Shui Poetry in the Parks has grant funding through 2026’s spring semester, but next school year is still up in the air. Cheng says she’s looking for other grants, but as the Trump administration cuts humanities funding, including National Endowment for the Arts grants, the options are scarce.

As the oldest of five growing up in Oakland, Cheng felt seen for the first time when she discovered poetry in elementary school. It was inspired by her most cherished memories: field trips. At the time, her immigrant family worked to the point where they were often “too busy for nature.” During field trips, it was exciting, she said, to be out of Oakland’s urban landscape and in parks that felt rare in her working-class experience.

Decades after her elementary school field trips, as a newly appointed poet laureate for West Hollywood, she envisioned a way to mirror this childhood experience.

Poets laureate, whose role is to champion and encourage poetry in their community, are eligible for a $50,000 nationwide grant through the Academy of American Poets to support “meaningful, impactful and innovative projects,” according to the AAP.

As a recipient of this grant, Cheng brought Feng Shui Poetry in the Parks to life with one final addition — a teacher with a passion for poetry, who could connect her to a classroom of students.

Everyone she spoke to, she said, pointed her to the same person — “Mr. V.”

Jen Cheng, left, and Steve Valenzuela, right, close the Feng Shui Poetry in the Parks reading with words of encouragement for the students who shared their poetry at Bravo High School on Dec. 4, 2025. Both instructors have said that they were surprised by the emotion and creativity the students demonstrated in their poems.

(Kayte Deioma)

A sanctuary for ‘lifesaving’ creativity

When you enter Valenzuela’s classroom, the walls are covered with dozens of CD sleeves, from Deftones to Rage Against the Machine. In the gaps, student artwork, notes and photos with current and former students hang.

Valenzuela leads Bravo High’s poetry club, KEEPERS, and for the last few years, he’s guided the students to win awards at international poetry slam Get Lit.

“Poetry is expression, poetry is life-changing, lifesaving, which sounds very dramatic, but it’s not. Some of the things the students have written about are very traumatic,” Valenzuela said. “I’ve seen them work through difficult experiences and come out of it using poetry.”

One such student is 17-year-old Paige Thibodeaux. “I used to think it was better to be closed off, but throughout this, I was able to show my friends and peers who I am,” Paige said. “I didn’t think that’s something I could do and I’m here now.”

Paige, who lives with her family in Compton, recalled having her guard up as she walked through her neighborhood, where she said expression through poetry felt inaccessible.

“I don’t see a lot of kids doing things like this,” she said.

Student poets, friends and family members gather before the start of the Feng Shui Poetry in the Parks poetry reading and zine release at Bravo High School on Dec. 4, 2025.

(Kayte Deioma)

Working on a book, she said, opened up a whole new side of her. She started to confide in friends about stress, or things that bothered her, which otherwise would have stayed inside.

‘I still don’t believe it’

Since August 2025, Paige and her classmates have developed their poems, received feedback from Cheng and submitted their final pieces to be published as a poetry collection.

The cover, designed by Bravo student Adrian Lopez, depicts a tree wrapping around the spine. The poems are rooted in their observations of current affairs and native plants; the publication was completed in December, when Valenzuela and Cheng planned for a reading and celebration of their work at Bravo High.

“Did you guys know your work is going to be read across the country?” Cheng said to students in class one day. “I’m sending it all the way to New York!”

“Feng Shui Poetry in the Parks Vol. 1” is being printed as a zine and will be sent to bookstores and libraries from San Francisco to Chicago as well as the Library of Congress.

Students giggled and gasped in disbelief. “No pressure, I guess,” one student joked.

“It’s really crazy, I still don’t believe it. It’s been a dream of mine,” Alina said. “I never realized I could be a published author as a junior in high school.”

The night of the poetry reading, students, parents and friends gathered in excitement in Bravo High School’s library, settling in rows before a single microphone. Out in the hallway, the raucous chatter of teenagers echoed in the halls, and cars honked on the busy street outside to pick them up. But inside the haven of the library, there was a quiet settling among the crowd for the long-awaited show.

Alina Sadibekova reads her poems “I Want to Fly” and “Messy” for the Feng Shui Poetry in the Parks reading at Bravo High School on Dec. 4, 2025. She says writing poetry over the course of the program “grounded” her and alleviated the stress of school.

(Kayte Deioma)

Aolani “Lani” Alarcon approached the mic to hushed voices. As the lights lowered, she thanked the crowd, the white flower tucked in her hair catching the light as she recited her first poem, “White Sage.”

She says poetry didn’t always come easily to her. “One of the biggest things I struggle with is judgment, so opening up or writing about touchy subjects or things that mean something to me was hard,” Lani said. “Knowing that I wouldn’t be judged, or that people would actually like what I write, means a lot.”

The 16-year-old smiled as she read, describing sage as an ancestor’s prayer. Her next poem, “Hummingbird,” delved into grief.

“You teach me that healing isn’t forgetting,” she read, tears welling. “It’s learning to carry love without breaking under it.”

Manuel Alarcon, her father, was seated in the crowd, clasping his hands in rapt attention. When the readings had finished, he pulled Lani into a long embrace.

“These field trips, it exposed them outside of city life,” Alarcon said. “There’s more than opening a book, listening to a teacher. You need that outside exposure to really understand life. And inner city kids don’t have that. I want [my daughter] to be part of breaking a cycle.”

Valenzuela clapped loudly and cheered as each student stepped off the podium.

“When young voices, and voices from marginalized communities tend to be silenced, sometimes we internalize that and silence ourselves,” Valenzuela said. “I want them to feel like they can speak up.”

As Feng Shui Poetry in the Parks carries on for another semester— maybe its last — students continue to explore writing poetry in the greens of L.A. parks. Some, like 17-year-old Saneli Soto, express themselves along the way.

Saneli’s poem reads:

I’m used to concrete floors
And concrete walls.
I’m used to five story buildings.
I needed a quiet place.
Where I could just lie in the grass.

CORTINA D’AMPEZZO — CORTINA D’AMPEZZO, Italy — The mountainside packed with fans and competitors was eerily silent after disaster struck.

Lindsey Vonn, attempting to win a gold medal despite sustaining a torn anterior cruciate ligament in her final race before the Games, clipped her pole on a gate early in her first Olympic downhill skiing run and crashed Sunday.

Vonn, 41, could be heard screaming after the crash. She received medical attention on the snow and was airlifted off the mountain.

The race was halted while Vonn was treated. Her teammate, Breezy Johnson, held the early lead and went on to win the race after the competition resumed. Johnson won the Americans’ first gold medal of the Games.

The U.S. downhill team celebrated with Johnson but continued to think of Vonn.

American Lindsey Vonn crashes into a gate during an alpine ski downhill race at the Winter Olympics in Cortina d’Ampezzo, Italy, Sunday.

(Handout / Getty Images)

“It’s heartbreaking,” said American Isabella Wright, who finished 22nd in the competition. “Jackie [Wiles] and myself, we were up there. We watched it live and things just happen so quick in this sport. It looked like Lindsey had incredible speed out of that turn and she hooked her arm [on a gate on the course] and it’s just over. Just like that. After all the preparation, after years of hard work and rehabilitation and all the things, it’s the last thing you want to see somebody go through.”

Vonn retired after a series of injuries seemed to be too much to overcome. Nearly six years later, she announced she missed racing and was confident she had fully recovered her form after a right knee replacement.

She shocked many by immediately winning races needed to qualify for the Games and entered the Olympics as the leader in the World Cup downhill standings. Nine days ago, she suffered a torn ACL, a bone bruise and meniscus damage.

Amid great scrutiny, Vonn was determined to keep racing with the support of her medical team and a large knee brace. She was optimistic about her ability to compete after practice runs and pushed back at critics on the social media platform X.

Fans react after watching American Lindsey Vonn crash during the women’s downhill skiing race at the Winter Olympics Sunday.

(Robert Gauthier/Los Angeles Times)

“It’s the last thing you want to see for Lindsey, but she should be really proud of everything she has gone through to get back here,” Wright said. “And regardless, if got last today, if she won — she obviously crashed. Whatever happened today, she’s an inspiration to all of us and she should be really proud. I know it probably doesn’t feel like that right now, but I hope one day she can recognize that.”

MILAN — Mike Tirico was baptized on the day of Super Bowl I.

Sunday, the NBC play-by-play announcer will be baptized by fire.

Not only will Tirico call the Super Bowl for the first time, but he will stay on the Levi’s Stadium field after the game to remotely host Sunday night’s coverage of the Winter Olympics.

From football’s mountaintop to the majestic peaks of Northern Italy, it’s an unprecedented double play in the broadcasting business.

“We’ll keep the Super Bowl celebration threaded into the Olympic show — confetti, family moments, that sort of thing,” said Tirico, 59, who worked both events four years ago but didn’t call that Super Bowl at SoFi Stadium, instead hosting the pregame show.

“What I learned from Super Bowl LVI is that it’s possible to do this without cheating either job.”

Maybe so, but it requires the extraordinary organization and preparation for which Tirico is famous within the network. Each year, he distributes to colleagues a color-coded calendar — a different color for every sport he’s covering that day — and the patchwork on every page looks like the Partridge family bus.

“Mike is the world’s best multitasker,” said Rob Hyland, coordinating producer of “Sunday Night Football.”

“This is in his DNA. It’s how he’s wired.”

Even for Tirico, however, the task is ambitious. The day after calling the Rams’ divisional playoff game at Chicago, he boarded a flight for Italy to check out the NBC studios in Milan. It was all part of getting comfortable with the setup.

On Super Bowl Sunday, hours before the Seattle Seahawks and New England Patriots take the field, Tirico will be up at 4:30 on the West Coast to watch Lindsey Vonn in the women’s downhill. He then will try to get back to sleep to prepare for his long day of football, knowing he will be running on adrenaline deep into the night. At halftime, he’ll carve out a few minutes to get up to speed on what’s happening in Italy.

On Monday, he and others from NBC will fly to Milan, with Tirico beginning his in-studio Olympics coverage Tuesday.

Tirico is just the 13th play-by-play announcer to call a national Super Bowl broadcast. He said Sunday will be like being back at Syracuse and taking three final exams in one day. He figures he will graze his way through the day but doesn’t plan to sit down for a meal, per se.

“They always say you should be slightly hungry when you take a test,” he said. “I subscribe to that theory on game day.”

Whereas preparation for the Super Bowl begins the moment the participating teams are determined, Tirico said his work on the Olympics has been years in the making.

“You want to be prepared but not over-prepared,” he said, referring to both events. “You want to know the important things you can get to during the game.”

The key is to use the information judiciously without overloading the audience with facts and statistics.

“With all that detail and information as granular as he can get, he never loses sight of what’s important for a mass audience,” Hyland said. “Mike is a unicorn. He’s one of one.”

As for Hyland, he’s one and done. After the Super Bowl, he will head home to Connecticut and become part of said audience.

“I’ll be playing the role of dad back on my couch in Southport with our six-month-old baby boy,” he said. “I’ll be watching the Olympics as a fan.”

In a sense, Tirico is a fan, too. There’s still a kernel of disbelief that this is his job.

“This is the thing that happens after you stop dreaming,” he said. “Because your dreams never let you get this far.”

FRANKFORT, Ky. — Gavin Newsom was in his element, moving and shaking amid the rich and powerful in Davos.

He scolded European leaders for supposedly cowering before President Trump.

He drew disparaging notice during a presidential rant and captured headlines after being blocked from delivering a high-profile speech, allegedly at the behest of the White House.

All the while, another governor and Democratic presidential prospect was mixing and mingling in the rarefied Swiss air — though you probably wouldn’t know it.

Flying far below the heat-seeking radar, Kentucky Gov. Andy Beshear leaned into the role of economic ambassador, focusing on job creation and other nutsy, boltsy stuff that doesn’t grab much notice in today’s performative political environment.

Like Newsom, Beshear is running-but-not-exactly-running for president. He didn’t set out to offer a stark contrast to California’s governor, the putative 2028 Democratic front-runner. But he’s doing so just the same.

Want someone who’ll match Trump insult for insult, over-the-top meme for over-the-top meme and howl whenever the president commits some new outrage? Look to Sacramento, not Frankfort.

“I think by the time we reach 2028, our Democratic voters are gonna be worn out,” Beshear said during a conversation in his state’s snowy capital. “They’re gonna be worn out by Trump, and they’re gonna be worn out by Democrats who respond to Trump like Trump. And they’re gonna want some stability in their lives.”

Every candidate enters a contest with a backstory and a record, which is condensed to a summary that serves as calling card, strategic foundation and a rationale for their run.

Here’s Andy Beshear’s: He’s the popular two-term governor of a red state that three times voted overwhelmingly for Trump.

He is fluent in the language of faith, well-liked by the kind of rural voters who have abandoned Democrats in droves and, at age 48, offers a fresh face and relative youth in a party that many voters have come to see as old and ossified.

The fact he’s from the South, where Arkansas Gov. Bill Clinton emerged the last time Democrats experienced this kind of existential freak-out, also doesn’t hurt.

Beshear’s not-yet-candidacy, still in the fledgling phase, offers a mix of aspiration and admonition.

Democrats, he said, need to talk more like regular people. Addiction, not substance use disorder. Hunger, not food assistance.

And, he suggested, they need to focus more on things regular people care about: jobs, healthcare, public safety, public education. Things that aren’t theoretical or abstract but materially affect their daily lives, like the costs of electricity, car insurance and groceries.

“I think the most important thing we should have learned from 2024 is [Democratic voters are] gonna be looking for somebody that can help them pay that next bill,” Beshear said.

He was seated in the Old Governor’s Mansion, now a historic site and Beshear’s temporary office while the nearby Capitol undergoes a years-long renovation.

The red-brick residence, built in the Federal style and completed in 1798, was Beshear’s home from age 6 to 10 when his father, Steve, lived there while serving as lieutenant governor. (Steve Beshear went on to serve two terms as the state’s chief executive, building a brand and a brand name that helped Andy win his first public office, attorney general, in 2015.)

It was 9 degrees outside. Icicles hung from the eaves and snowplows navigated Frankfort’s narrow, winding streets after an unusually cold winter blast.

Inside, Beshear was seated before an unlit fireplace, legs crossed, shirt collar unbuttoned, looking like the pleasantly unassuming Dad in a store-bought picture frame.

He bragged a bit, touting Kentucky’s economic success under his watch. He spoke of his religiosity — his grandfather and great-grandfather were Baptist preachers — and talked at length about the optimism, a political rarity these days, that undergirds his vision for the country.

“I think the American people feel like the pendulum swung too far in the Biden administration. Now they feel it’s swung way too far during the Trump administration,” Beshear said. “What they want is for it to stop swinging.”

He went on. “Most people when they wake up aren’t thinking about politics. They’re thinking about their job, their next doctor’s appointment, the roads and bridges they drive, the school they drop their kids off at, and whether they feel safe in their community.

“And I think they desperately want someone that can move the country, not right or left ideologically, but actually forward in those areas. And that’s how I think we heal.”

Beshear doesn’t shy from his Democratic pedigree, or stray from much of the party’s orthodoxy.

Seeking reelection in 2023, he seized on the abortion issue and the Supreme Court’s overturning of Roe vs. Wade to batter and best his Republican opponent.

He’s walked the picket line with striking auto workers, signed an executive order making Juneteenth a state holiday and routinely vetoed anti-gay legislation, becoming the first Kentucky governor to attend an LGBTQ+ celebration in the Capitol Rotunda.

“Discrimination against our LGBTQ+ community is unacceptable,” he told an audience. “It holds us back and, in my Kentucky accent, it ain’t right.”

For all of that, Beshear doesn’t shrink from taking on Trump, which, essentially, has become a job requirement for any Democratic officeholder wishing to remain a Democratic officeholder.

After the president’s rambling Davos address, Beshear called Trump’s remarks “dangerous, disrespectful and unhinged.”

“From insulting our allies to telling struggling Americans that he’s fixed inflation and the economy is amazing, the President is hurting both our families’ financial security and our national security,” Beshear posted on social media. “Oh, and Greenland is so important he’s calling it Iceland.”

But Beshear hasn’t turned Trump-bashing into a 24/7 vocation, or a weight-lifting contest where the winner is the critic wielding the heaviest bludgeon.

“I stand up to him in the way that I think a Democratic governor of Kentucky should. When he’s doing things that hurt my state, I speak out,” Beshear said. “I filed 20 lawsuits, I think, and we’ve won almost all of them, bringing dollars they were trying to stop from flowing into Kentucky.

“But,” he added, “when he does something positive for Kentucky, I also say that too, because that’s what our people expect.”

Asked about the towel-snapping Newsom and his dedicated staff of Trump trollers, Beshear defended California’s governor — or, at least, passed on the chance to get in a dig.

“Gavin’s in a very different situation than I’m in. I mean, he has the president attacking him and his state just about every day,” Beshear said. “So I don’t want to be critical of an approach from somebody that’s in a very different spot.

“But the approach also has to be unique to you. For me, I bring people together. We’ve been able to do that in this state. That’s my approach. And in the end, I’ve gotta stay true to who I am.”

And when — or make that if — both Newsom and Beshear launch a formal bid for president, they’ll present Democratic voters a clear choice.

Not just between two differing personalities. Also two considerably different approaches to politics and winning back the White House.

As is always the case, the Grammys this year will be dominated by pop, rap, country and rock. But the best races often lie in the less mainstream genres. Take best jazz vocal album, where Samara Joy, Dee Dee Bridgewater and Bill Charlap, Michael Mayo, Terri Lyne Carrington and Christie Dashiell and Nicole Zuraitis are competing for the honor.

The highly impressive group reflects the current state of jazz, where both young guns and veterans are combining to bring the music to a new swell of fans. To talk about the present state of jazz, The Times brought together 26-year-old Joy and 75-year-old Bridgewater. What followed is an incredible conversation on politics, race, equality and mutual fandom.

You both have had Grammy success. But is it still just as thrilling to be nominated?

Dee Dee Bridgewater: I can speak on that because I haven’t been nominated in years. And yeah, it’s a thrill when you’re nominated and you haven’t been and you’ve done something that your peers think is Grammy worthy. I don’t know about Samara, but for me, I don’t do any of my recorded projects with the intention of getting a Grammy nomination, which seems to be the goal of a lot of younger artists. So that me doing something that I just was trying to chronicle and because of this work that Bill and I have been doing off and on for the last few years, it’s like the icing on the cake. It’s wonderful.

Samara Joy: Agreed, when I say I’m just grateful to be here, like in this space, being able to talk about this in this way, I mean it. It wasn’t the intention behind making the music that I love to make with the people I love to make it with. And when kids come up to me and they say, “Because of you, now my goal is to be a Grammy winner.” I’m like, “You’ve already strayed way off course. We need to come back.” And realize that the accolades and the awards and the acknowledgment is beautiful because it’s coming from your peers and we’re celebrating each other. It’s amazing, it’s exciting, it’s wonderful. I’m grateful for it. But at the same time, the other 364 days of the year, we’re working and we’re touring and we’re performing because we love it. And it’s with the intention of seeing what else we can learn and express and finding new ways to do that. I’m grateful to be in the conversation, but also I’m using it even more as an opportunity to thank the people who support us and who listen to the music and who come to the concerts to say that that’s what I love. So, the fact that people have connected with it enough to acknowledge it on such a high level is amazing, but the love of it never goes away.

Bridgewater: Yes, I agree with that, Samara. When I do my work, because I like to call myself an artist who flies under the radar, I’m basically out there trying to bring joy to people. With the music that I do, I try to change up the projects depending on what is going on in the world or depending on what I’m thinking about and feeling about society and just trying to make a connection with people and be a conduit for the people and speak through the songs, things that I think will bring them joy or get them to think about some things that they are not wanting to say out loud. So, that’s what I’m doing right now. Then with my music, what I’m trying to do is bring more attention to women in jazz. For the last few years, aside from my occasional concerts with Bill [Charlap], I have been working with women. I have created a band. I call it We Exist! We are doing socially conscious music, some protest songs, and that is what I’m taking around the world. Generally, people come up to me and say, “Thank you so much for saying these things for us. We need to hear this.” My concern at my older age, now that I’m in my golden years, is the state of society and the world and this political crisis that we are in. So, I’m trying to speak about this in a way that people can hear it without getting on some kind of political bandstand and speaking in that way. I think that the world is in danger politically and I think our democracy is in danger. That’s my concern and that’s what I’m trying to do through my music. Also, I want people to see more women in the jazz space, and I think as an elder it’s almost an obligation of mine to lead that front and present this and present this image. I get many women that come up and say, “Thank you so much for doing this for women.” So, that’s where my head is right now.

Dee Dee Bridgewater

(Hernan Rodriguez)

How exciting is it to see that, of the jazz vocal nominees, four of the five are women?

Bridgewater: Yeah, and isn’t that wonderful? But I can say this, for vocal jazz, it usually is women. This has been the place where we have been allowed to shine as vocalists. It’s been for many, many years, the only place where we’re allowed to shine. So, when you get female instrumentalists besides Terri Lyne [Carrington] because Terri Lyne broke through in a period of when there were not a lot of jazz drummers, so that she worked with Herbie [Hancock] and she worked with Wayne [Shorter]. They gave her a platform that most women are not granted. Of course, also, one has to be extremely talented. And Terri Lyne can stand beside any man and hold her own and outdo many men. That’s not the point. The point is that she had that opportunity. They gave her that opportunity and then she’s been able to pay it forward. But to see instrumentalists like Lakecia Benjamin who has really come to the forefront as an alto saxophonist and to see her get Grammy nominations, that’s something that, for me, is huge.

Samara, talk about what you’re seeing in the scene today in terms of gender disparity and overall vibe.

Joy: I’ve had the opportunity to play with some amazing ones. I went to the Vanguard a few weeks ago and sat in with [Christian] McBride and Savannah Harris was on drums. I played with Alexandra Ridout, who is an incredible trumpet player as well. Although I understand the disparity in the current time and throughout history, I also understand that I might be living through a privileged time where I just kind of see women around me everywhere. So, I don’t understand what it’s like to be without it on the scene. I can read about the fact that maybe at a time saxophone was taking precedence over jazz vocals or with each era, there’s a new focus. But I guess on the scene now I’m proud to be able to see all of these wonderful women composers and instrumentalists stepping to the forefront.

Both of you have made music that is very uplifting as well. In these difficult times, music is something that can lift the spirits and bring people together. For each of you talk about making music that uplifts because there are so many great jazz standards that have the point of lifting up the world.

Bridgewater: I’m here in town at Birdland with Bill Charlap and we are doing songs from the American Songbook primarily and Duke Ellington. It has nothing to do with anything that’s going on today, politically speaking. Last night was our first show and the audience just loved it. So, there is that side that one can take. And I’ve been very apolitical. It’s just since the two Trump administrations and the Gaza war that happened and some other things that I’ve seen going on outside of the United States that have really incensed me that I felt the need to speak out in the way that I am, you know. But it is wonderful to go to a show and have people come to see a show and be able to completely lose themselves and be outside of what is going on for that span of time that they are with the artists. For the other side, when I do these socially conscious songs, people come and say, “Oh my God, thank you. I needed to hear that. I needed to hear someone.” Because my point at the end of my show is I say, “We the people have the power, we can’t forget that. We are the people that can motivate the change and protect our democracy because we see democracy being chipped away around the world.” I grew up in an era where there was a distinct difference between Black and white and I was not able to be served when I would go to sit at a lunch counter as a little Black girl. So, I’ve experienced both sides. My awareness is different than Samara’s and I feel the alarms. The alarm bells are just ringing for me. But when I come back and I do a show with Bill, sometimes it’s difficult for me to get into these sweet, innocent songs because they don’t have the gravitas that I’m experiencing doing a Nina Simone song like “Mississippi Goddam.” For me, artistically speaking, it’s been interesting to find a balance. Samara, you do these beautiful songs with that stunning voice of yours. Your take is totally different. And you’ve grown up in another era.

Joy: This is the first time in my life that I have not only been aware of what’s happening in the world but also feel compelled. Like, I have a responsibility to do something about it because I’ve never been so aware of what is happening around me as I am right now. I don’t know if that’s a good thing or bad thing but I just feel like, ”OK, I’m an adult and this is the world that I live in and I have a responsibility as one of the people living in this world to not only do something about it right now but do something for the next generation of people who are going to have to live in the world that results in what we do right now.” It’s scary. I don’t know how people do it, especially because it’s not as difficult right now. It’s not as difficult for me to say something that might have been for an Abbey Lincoln or Nina Simone or whoever. I’m also living in a sort of luxury in that way that I don’t have to speak out and be the only one who is doing so and then be proven right later. In that way, I’m like, “I have to because of all these women who have gone before me, who made that difference and who stood and didn’t get appreciated or thanked for it in the moment, have made it so that the world that I live in now, as crazy as it is, I’m able to have a platform in the first place and be able to lead some sort of charge — or at least spread some sort of message so that the world that we’re building for the ones who come later. It’s not just about me right now, it’s all interconnected.” It feels a little heavy, a little scary. I’m still trying to figure out where my voice fits.

Bridgewater: You know what, honey, I get that. When I was your age, I honestly was not at all concerned about politics and what was going on. I was concerned about my Blackness because I’ve experienced our people being named four different times. When I was a little girl, I was colored, then I was Negro, and when they said Black, I was incensed because your hair is black. Our skin is brown. But I understand where you’re coming from because you are coming up in a different time. And you are just beginning to navigate all of the politics, so you’re going to probably go through a similar kind of thing that I went through when I was young, and I concentrated on just writing my music and things that spoke to me. You’re fine where you are and you’re going to learn to navigate all of this in time and what I would hope for you is that you don’t feel a weight. We’re all going to feel this heaviness because of the situation that we’re in but as an artist, I want you to feel free to discover and do the things that you feel in your spirit and not feel led to do something because it’s what’s going on around you. You’ve got to continue to stay true to yourself, which you’ve been doing, which is wonderful. I’m at a different stage in my life. I’m in the last quarter of my life. I’m 75 and I’ve been through all of this stuff. I feel like I’m at a place where if I want to say something instead of not like I’ve done in the past, I’m going to speak my mind. I want to say this to Samara and I’ve said this to her before. But I am so proud of you and what you are doing. And you have a voice that the gods have blessed you with, Samara. At my age to be in the same space with you for the Grammys, I am so tickled. I love you so dearly. I truly do, and you know that. The times that we’ve been on stage together, it’s been wonderful for me. I want you to know that there are people who are your elders who, besides loving you like we do, we depend on you, Samara. You have been able to enter the space and bring jazz to the world in a way that we were not.

Joy: I love you too. I’m sitting here thinking about one of the first times I got the chance to see you perform at Blue Note. I was there with my professor at the time. I was so nervous, but I’m so honored to know you. I’m so honored to have loved you from afar and now get the chance to love you up close and honor you and appreciate you and shower you just as you have showered me.

If you were going to do one song together at the Grammys, what would you want to do?

Joy: “I Wish I Knew How it Would Feel to be Free,” [Nina Simone].

Bridgewater: That’s in my repertoire. I do that. That would be a great one, Samara. I’m on board. We would tear it up.

This article contains spoilers for Part 1 of Season 4 of “Bridgerton.”

Luke Thompson and Yerin Ha are lounging on a blue velvet couch in a swanky green room inside of Netflix’s offices in New York, bracing for the whirlwind that inevitably envelops every pair of actors who become the central couple in a season of the popular romance drama “Bridgerton.” And they’re still settling into the idea of being romantic leads.

“It doesn’t feel real,” Ha says fresh into their first press day in early December. “Because for a very long time, I didn’t think that it was possible for me — maybe I should have dreamed bigger. To keep saying that I’m the lead of a season feels really bizarre.”

“But maybe that’s a way of coping with it,” Thompson says. “I remember in Season 1, I just finished a Zoom call and I just sat in my living room and it was the first time I really touched into the idea that millions of people are watching this thing. Millions of people. And I never did it again.”

“You just did it for me now,” Ha says with a smidgen of dread that launches the pair into laughter. “That’s not really helping.”

Thompson, though, isn’t feeling the pressure of keeping the romance alive and extremely meme-able as they take up the mantle of the Regency-era fairy tale.

“It’s a show that’s proven time and time again that there’s huge appetite for romance,” he says. “It was a genre that might have been, not looked down on, but not really taken very seriously. To be able to incarnate some projection of romance for people, particularly in January and February, when people are feeling a bit miserable, maybe, it’s lovely to be part of that.”

The duo play Benedict and Sophie, affectionately dubbed #Benophie, a couple whose story gives the classic Cinderella tale a bit of steam and is one that readers of Julia Quinn’s “An Offer From a Gentleman,” which inspired this season, know well. Thompson’s Benedict, whom “Bridgerton” viewers have come to know as the artistic, pansexual second-oldest son of the Bridgerton clan, has long shown disinterest in settling down or adhering to societal norms. But then in Part 1 of Season 4, released Thursday, he meets Sophie Baek, a maid in her abusive stepmother’s home, at a masquerade ball hosted by his mother. Viewers eventually learn Sophie’s servitude is forced after her parentage is revealed — she’s the illegitimate daughter of an earl.

Yerin Ha as Sophie Baek and Luke Thompson as Benedict Bridgerton during their masquerade ball meet-cute in Season 4.

(Liam Daniel / Netflix)

Showrunner Jess Brownell says this season, they were is interested in prodding the wish-fulfillment fantasy many of us were introduced to at a young age.

“We learn about them as children from Disney movies,” she says. “For us, though, in interacting with this trope, it was really important to interrogate it a little bit. I think what our interrogation hopefully reveals is that oftentimes it’s the prince figure or the man of a ‘higher station’ who … needs to do some work on himself, to step out of his fantasy life a little bit and step more into reality to be worthy of the love of a Cinderella-type. It’s not to say that the Sophie character doesn’t have her own journey to go on, I think that she absolutely has to let her walls down and has to allow herself to dream of and believe in the possibility of love.”

Over a video call from that cozy couch inside Netflix’s offices, Thompson and Ha discussed navigating the spotlight as the newest “Bridgerton” couple, this season’s very unromantic declaration of love and trying to capture a swoon-worthy meet-cute behind an oversized mask.

The excitement for this season is already in full effect. How are you feeling about Benophie as the couple name? Am I even pronouncing it right?

Thompson: I don’t know!

Ha: I think that is right. I initially said Ben-off-ee like Banoffee pie, but then I realized it wouldn’t make sense because it’s So-fee. So Ben-o-fee would make more sense.

Thompson: There’s been a couple of fun AI pictures.

Ha: I actually just got one yesterday from my mom about our kids, our future kids. [Thompson laughs.] And I was like, “Mom, why are you on the internet looking at these things?” So it’s really out there, and I’m really being fed it out of my own will, but it’s amazing to see people already so excited about it and wanting to create things and future possibilities. It’s quite amazing. And the fans are actually so lovely.

Thompson: I think that’s one of the best things about social media, actually; that whole aspect of people projecting or imagining themselves or creating stuff sometimes. That’s something that we never used to be able to really get a handle on, but to be able to see the amount of energy and thought that people put into it is kind of amazing.

Ha: Also creative artistry. So many fans are drawing, sketching. It’s incredible. The amount of talent that people just share with us, it’s really beautiful.

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1. The “Bridgerton” couples over the seasons: Simon Basset (Regé-Jean Page) and Daphne Bridgerton (Phoebe Dynevor) in Season 1. 2. Kate Sharma (Simone Ashley) and Anthony Bridgerton (Jonathan Bailey) in Season 2. 3. Colin Bridgerton (Luke Newton) and Penelope Featherington (Nicola Coughlan) in Season 3. 4. Benedict Bridgerton (Luke Thompson) and Sophie Baek (Yerin Ha) in Season 4. (Liam Daniel / Netflix)

Luke, you’ve had three seasons to observe how others have taken on this mantle. Did Jonathan or Luke impart any words of wisdom as you stepped into lead duties? Did you have any observations in watching them navigate the spotlight and the intensity of this?

They were always very, very open to offering advice — Regé[-Jean Page, who led the first season as Simon Bassett, the Duke of Hastings], as well; all three of them. That’s been really, really helpful to know that it’s there. In terms of observing them, that’s why I’ve had a bit of a lucky ride, really, because I got to watch them. I mean this in a positive way — Regé is very serious. There’s something about the nature of the show that could encourage you to be a bit more light about it, but I think he really took it very seriously. Johnny [Jonathan Bailey, who plays Anthony Bridgerton] has this amazing energy that’s extremely contagious. I watched that and how that affects the atmosphere on set. And then Luke [Newton, who plays Colin Bridgerton] is very sensitive and he’s very careful and clued in terms of how and when he expresses himself. I’m so lucky I got to watch all of them do it and admire them and think about them and think also about how it would work for me.

What about you, Yerin? You’re a newcomer to this fictional world being thrown into the deep end. Did you get any useful feedback from Nicola Coughlan or Simone Ashley?

I didn’t have the years of looking at the other leads actually experience it. But Nicola and Simone, from the get-go when I was cast, they offered to give me advice and be like, “We’re here for you if you need it.” But the thing about it is, everyone is so different and unique with what they actually struggle with and what is going to be their challenge. I didn’t really know what I wanted advice about, but it was just always so nice and supportive to know that they were there if I needed them. But also, Luke, who was my main scene partner, was in “Bridgerton” for years, so I was able to also lean on him and also the other fellow castmates if I felt insecure or if I didn’t really know how to go about things.

Luke Thompson on “Bridgerton”: “It’s a show that’s proven time and time again that there’s huge appetite for romance,” he says. “To be able to incarnate some projection of romance for people, particularly in January and February, when people are feeling a bit miserable, maybe, it’s lovely to be part of that.”

(Tyler Twins / For The Times)

This being “Bridgerton,” the chemistry between Benedict and Sophie is so crucial to the magic of their story and how it develops over time. Tell me about the chemistry read. What do you remember about meeting each other?

Thompson: It was like this.

Ha: You’re third wheeling with us.

Thompson: It was on Zoom.

Ha: I was in Korea. It was 11 p.m. and I was trying to manage my nerves the entire day, which was quite stressful. And then I logged on, you [Thompson] were there. You had a striped shirt on, I remember — quite vividly, actually. I said that he looked quite tired. Maybe it was me projecting, thinking that he was having lots of auditions, reading with lots of people by then.

Thompson: I’m trying to think how many; we hadn’t auditioned that many people because it’s a very particular part. What we were asking or looking for was fairly particular. That’s the other thing I thought: How are we going to be able to do a chemistry read on Zoom? With all the awkwardness of doing it on Zoom — having to pretend that you’re turning your back and there’s a lake and having to sort of mime in front of the camera is so, so cheesy — despite all of that, I just remember reading scenes with you and feeling very relaxed. You know it when you see it. As soon as the Zoom call ended, I told you, Tom Verica [an executive producer and a director of the series] was a bit teary, and we were like, “Well, obviously it’s her.”

Ha: Obviously the stakes are so high on my end, because he’s already in the show, so I was so focused on just trying to be present and not trying to force anything. I think that’s when it gets a little bit weird. I just remember looking at you in the screen, and Luke’s such an open person anyways, and so it was quite easy to do the scene, despite that there was lots of interjections in the audition scene that we had to do, but we just pushed through.

What were the scenes that you had to do together that day? The lake scene —

Thompson: The lake scene and the tea scene. Just two.

In Season 4, viewers know Sophie (Yerin Ha) is the lady whom Benedict (Luke Thompson) meets at the masquerade ball, but he hasn’t connected the dots when they meet again later.

(Liam Daniel / Netflix)

In the world of romance, how two characters meet is often as important as how they get together. And the masquerade ball holds a lot of excitement and expectations for fans of the book. How did you feel tackling that scene? Did the masks help alleviate any nerves?

Ha: For me, it was a bit more pressure in the sense that my mask is so big [Thompson laughs], it’s hard to actually be quite expressive when your cheekbones are hidden under this mask. I just remember sometimes Tom would be like, “You got to express more with your eyes and your lips.”

Thompson: It’s basically like you were wearing a paper bag.

Ha: Yes! So, that was a challenge, but also, in a way, sometimes masks make you feel a little bit invincible … Sophie, especially in that night, the mask makes her brave and courageous; when she takes off the physical mask, that’s when the metaphorical mask actually comes into play.

Thompson: You’re right. The mask thing is integral to how they both meet. They even talk about it when they’re on the gazebo, the terrace; they have that whole scene where it is all about asking questions, not answering questions. To Benedict, [with] Sophie you’re constantly like, “Is she in earnest? Does she actually not know how to dance? Is she joking that she doesn’t know how to dance? Is she playing the role of someone?” There’s so many different questions about it — and I think that’s what’s so romantic about it. It’s so recognizable because that’s always what love at first sight is. It’s not that in that moment, two people completely see each other; there’s a game that starts happening. It’s all about what they allow the other to see or not, and sometimes there’s these really nice bits where they keep missing each other. There’s that amazing bit … when she’s spying through the door, and then just as she leaves, Benedict looks. It’s the pattern of their relationship, it’s how it’s always been — and it starts in this amazing little dream.

I imagine there was there a lot of discussions on what these masks should look like?

Ha: Yes. The costume team are incredible; they had, like, five different versions of it. Some of it was just completely covering my face with material. And then they were like, “Maybe not.” Because obviously Benedict sees her later as Sophie, and so why doesn’t he recognize her? They had to play this really fine line. But they are so creative and quick to change and adapt and bring in new designs. It turned out really beautifully.

Thompson: One of my fears actually reading the book was, “Oh, is it going to seem a little silly [that] Benedict doesn’t recognize her?” But actually, it’s so ornate, the mask is such a thing. When I since watched the episodes, I was like, yeah, I buy that he can see and feel something. He just can’t put it together.

Yerin Ha on becoming a leading lady in “Bridgerton”: “It doesn’t feel real,” she says. “Because for a very long time, I didn’t think that it was possible for me — maybe I should have dreamed bigger.”

(Tyler Twins / For The Times)

Yerin, our first glimpse of you as Sophie was as she’s putting on the mask — she’s a mystery to both Benedict and the viewers in that first episode, but we come to learn her story, which has echoes of Cinderella. What excited you about Sophie?

Ha: The thing for me is Sophie’s character and morals; it’s the fact that despite all the obstacles and the challenges, she’s still able to lead and live the world with a really caring heart. She’s still witty and she still has a bit of humor to her. But to be honest with you, the thing for me that I really connected with Sophie was her journey and discovery into self-love and knowing that she’s also deserving of it. That’s something I, at least, talk about a lot with my friends — and what does self-love look like and feel like and mean to me? I learned a lot through Sophie, as well, and knowing that it’s who you decide to bring into your life. Love is not just in someone, it’s about the people in the community that you created.

Benedict’s sexuality, his fluidity, has been something the writers have explored in building his overall arc. How will that be discussed or addressed as his relationship with Sophie develops?

Thompson: It’s a tricky one, right? Benedict is quite striking as a character — I can understand why people see all sorts of identities and words that would apply to him in a modern context. A lot of particularly male sexuality, generally, can be portrayed in quite a box-y, angsty way — where it’s like, “Oh, you’re either gay or you’re straight, or this or that.” What’s nice about a character is that it’s a unique construction. It’s not a representation of any particular experience. It seems like, for him, his sexuality isn’t necessarily a big determiner of his identity; it is a symptom of him wanting to explore. He’s curious and he’s open. I guess what I’m trying to say is, if you’re truly open, that means you can form a connection with anyone. You could argue that it’s a force that has kept him, so far, at least, in a relentless chase for freedom and dodging the falling in love part, and I think I’m more interested in that.

About that — let’s get into his misguided declaration of love at the end of Part I. You read the books, you knew it was coming. It was the moment we‘ve come to expect from this show — until the last line where he asks her to be his mistress. How did you decide to play that moment?

Thompson: It is contextual, historically. There’s that scene in the Gentleman’s Club where, clearly, he can see that there are people who have that arrangement and do love each other. But I also think that’s a cop-out. That’s maybe trying to soften what is essentially Benedict’s main flaw. He’s been shown to be caring in many ways. But I also think the problem with someone like that is, if you’re charming to everyone, how can you develop something specific with one person? All of his front makes it very difficult for him to fall for someone, and to really engage and really commit to someone. Him saying that thing can be seen as him trying to have his cake and eat it — like, I’m going to splice the sort of fantasy I’ve got and the real world, and just mash it together and that will work.

He’s a bit blind. Season 4 is about his blindness, literally, in terms of recognizing her, but also that he can’t see that that wouldn’t be a perfect solution. He is maybe a bit blind about it and doesn’t necessarily consider how that might feel for Sophie. I would also say that he doesn’t have the information he needs from Sophie at that stage about being the lady in silver, which is an interesting tension. It’s fascinating because it’s a really dumb move from a character that you wouldn’t necessarily think would come from a character like that, but actually, to me, it makes complete sense that it would come from him. Benedict’s dad died very early, so he has an image of a loving relationship as something pretty terrifying, so you can understand why he’d want to avoid that, or want to find his way to escape the real commitment … but also have his cake.

Yerin, how did you feel about it?

Ha: I was so disappointed. I remember when we were doing the scene, I did actually feel genuinely angry. Benedict lives more in the fantasy realm, and Sophie definitely lives in more of the reality realm, but in that moment, it’s almost like she’s getting drunk on his words. She’s almost imagining as if there’s going to be a proposal, even though she knows that back in those days, that wouldn’t even really work. But she’s hoping and dreaming. But the minute he says that, she wakes up and she realizes, “Actually, this can never be”; her walls are back up. It almost takes her back to a place of her childhood and how she feels as a kid … It brings a lot of trauma back for her. I just remember doing that scene and feeling like I wanted to slap Benedict.

Thompson: We should have tried it. One take. I think people would have loved that.

At the end of Part 1, Thompson’s and Ha’s characters share a declaration of love gone wrong: “I remember when we were doing the scene, I did actually feel genuinely angry,” Ha says.

(Tyler Twins / For The Times)

Did you work with an intimacy coordinator for that scene? How was it to film that first moment of intimacy between the characters?

Ha: It was really hot on the set — literally, metaphorically. It was hot. It was the candles, and the air traveled up and it was a tiny, narrow set. But Lizzie, our intimacy coordinator, she is the best, she is incredible. There’s different ways that you can kind of go about it, where it’s paint by numbers or a blueprint, and just find your way to like A, B and C, which is more the vibe that we went through. She’s so amazing in the energy and space that she creates. She guides us and listens to each of us and what we need and how to make it maybe look a little bit nicer or rougher or whatever it is. I really lean on her as an intimacy coordinator, and felt very safe in those scenes because it is quite vulnerable and exposing.

Thompson: It was a security blanket, isn’t it? It’s just nice having someone to monitor it, so you’re not just stuck, just you two, or you and the director, who sometimes, in my previous … experience, directors are often quite embarrassed about those scenes, which drives me mad because I’m like, “You’re not the one that has to do this.” It’s all about trust. It’s very important to have that person there to facilitate and to have an outside eye on it because what feels good doesn’t necessarily look good. You need to have them choreographed because the actors can only really relate from the inside out, so they don’t know what stories being told outside.

This season’s story has hints of “Cinderella” in it. Did you channel any classic romance heroes, heroines or stories as you prepped?

Thompson: The masquerade ball made me think about Romeo and Juliet a lot. It’s Romeo and Juliet-coded, the way they meet and just going off somewhere private. I don’t think consciously, I thought about that, but when we were doing it, it really brought that into my head.

Ha: I guess because it’s the constant “Cinderella” nod, I really relied heavily on “Cinderella.” It does veer off from the “Cinderella” story. And I do want to acknowledge that it’s a starting point, not the actual plot line. She was my favorite princess growing up. I had a full dress with a Cinderella icon on it. I would wear that every second day.

Thompson: That’s so sweet.

Ha: I just wanted to meet my prince.

The first half ends with Benedict and Sophie at a crossroads, an impasse.

Thompson: Benedict and Sophie meet in dream scenarios. They meet in the masquerade ball, which is Sophie’s dream. Then they meet in [Benedict’s] cottage, which is sort of Benedict’s dream place. Then in [Episode] 4, they have to go back to the ton and the real world. It’s a struggle that everyone knows very well, when you fall for someone, and there’s the honeymoon period where you’re spinning this story together. Then it’s like, how do you deal with the real world, and how do you deal with getting bored with each other or getting angry with one another? It’ll be interesting to see how they find each other again.

Ha: Even reading the scripts, I was like, how are they going to make this work, especially acknowledging the class difference as well, nobility and her being a servant. Fans will really want to see how it all plays out. When society tells you can’t be with someone, what are you going to do about it? Are you going to surrender to that or are you going to fight for it? That’s going to be the journey for Part 2.

With any fandom, parasocial relationships form. There’s an attachment and shipping of fictional characters, but it can sometimes extend to the actors outside of the characters. How do you navigate that?

Ha: I think we’re just being us. What’s really lovely about Luke is that I have so much love for him as a human being, but I can’t control what people project and I can’t control what people will think and create a narrative and story. But I know my truth, and I know that I respect Luke as a human, as an actor, as a colleague, as a friend. We’re very professional, but we’re also good friends.

Thompson: That’s right. It’s nice to have stuff projected on you — that’s the joy of being an actor. You want people to look at you, want them to get lost in some idea of you. My point of view is always to absolutely welcome that and also say, but I don’t have to set the record straight for anyone. It’s their show. Even when I meet fans in the street, I don’t really think, “Oh, they’re coming for me.” They’re seeing the show. It’s a slightly overused word, but it is just about getting those boundaries straight in your head. You can’t really enjoy the attention that you get from fans because you think it’s coming for you. But actually, if you’ve got that nice boundary, you get to enjoy the attention from the fans.

SAN FRANCISCO — Katie Porter’s still standing, which is saying something.

The last time a significant number of people tuned into California‘s low-frequency race for governor was in October, when Porter’s political obituary was being written in bold type.

Immediately after a snappish and off-putting TV interview, Porter showed up in a years-old video profanely reaming a staff member for — the humanity! — straying into the video frame during her meeting with a Biden Cabinet member.

Not a good look for a candidate already facing questions about her temperament and emotional regulation. (Hang on, gentle reader, we’ll get to that whole gendered double-standard thing in a moment.)

The former Orange County congresswoman had played to the worst stereotypes and that was that. Her campaign was supposedly kaput.

But, lo, these several months later, Porter remains positioned exactly where she’d been before, as one of the handful of top contenders in a race that remains stubbornly formless and utterly wide open.

Did she ever think of exiting the contest, as some urged, and others plainly hoped to see? (The surfacing of that surly 2021 video, with the timing and intentionality of a one-two punch, was clearly not a coincidence.)

No, she said, not for a moment.

“Anyone who thinks that you can just push over Katie Porter has never tried to do it,” she said.

Porter apologized and expressed remorse for her tetchy behavior. She promised to do better.

“You definitely learn from your mistakes,” the Democrat said this week over a cup of chai in San Francisco’s Financial District. “I really have and I’ve spent a lot of time thinking about how do I show Californians who I am and that I really care about people who work for me. I need to earn back their trust and that’s what campaigns are literally about.”

She makes no excuse for acting churlish and wouldn’t bite when asked about that double standard — though she did allow as how Democratic leader John Burton, who died not long before people got busy digging Porter’s grave, was celebrated for his gruff manner and lavish detonation of f-bombs.

“It was a reminder,” she said, pivoting to the governor’s race, “that there have been other politicians who come on hot, come on strong and fight for what’s right and righteous and California has embraced them.”

Voters, she said, “want someone who will not back down.”

Porter warmed to the subject.

“If you are never gonna hurt anyone’s feelings, you are never gonna take [JPMorgan Chase Chief Executive] Jamie Dimon to task for not thinking about how his workers can’t afford to make ends meet. If you want everyone to love you, you are never gonna say to a big pharma CEO, ‘You didn’t make this cancer drug anymore. You just got richer, right?’ That is a feistiness that I’m proud of.”

At the same, Porter suggested, she wants to show there’s more to her persona than the whiteboard-wielding avenger that turned her into a viral sensation. The inquisitorial stance was, she said, her role as a congressional overseer charged with holding people accountable. Being governor is different. More collaborative. Less confrontational.

Her campaign approach has been to “call everyone, go everywhere” — even places Porter may not be welcomed — to listen and learn, build relationships and show “my ability to craft a compromise, my ability to learn and to change my mind.”

“All of that is really hard to convey,” she said, “in those whiteboard moments.”

The rap on this year’s pack of gubernatorial hopefuls is they’re a collective bore, as though the lack of A-list sizzle and failure to throw off sparks is some kind of mortal sin.

Porter doesn’t buy that.

“When we say boring, I think what we’re really saying is ‘I’m not 100% sure how all this is going to work out.’ People are waiting for some thing to happen, some coronation of our next governor. We’re not gonna have that.”

Gavin Newsom, she noted, was a high-profile former San Francisco mayor who spent eight years as lieutenant governor before winning the state’s top job. His predecessor was the dynastic Jerry Brown.

None of those running this time have that political pedigree, or the Sacramento backgrounds of Newsom or Brown, which, Porter suggested, is not a bad thing.

“I actually think this race has the potential to be really, really exciting for California,” she said. “… I think everyone in this race comes in with a little bit of a fresh energy, and I think that’s really good and healthy.”

Crowding into the conversation was, inevitably, Donald Trump, the sun around which today’s entire political universe turns.

Of course, Porter said, as governor she would stand up to the president. His administration’s actions in Minneapolis have been awful. His stalling on disaster relief for California is grotesque.

But, she said, Trump didn’t cause last year’s firestorm. He didn’t make housing in California obscenely expensive for the last many decades.

“When my children say ‘I don’t know if I want to go to college in California because we don’t have enough dorm housing,’ Trump has done plenty of horrible attacks on higher ed,” Porter said. “But that’s a homegrown problem that we need to tackle.”

Indeed, she’s “very leery of anyone who does not acknowledge that we had problems and policy challenges long before Donald Trump ever raised his orange head on the political horizon.”

Although California needs “someone who’s going to [buffer] us against Trump,” Porter said, “you can’t make that an excuse for why you are not tackling these policy changes that need to be.”

She hadn’t finished her tea, but it was time to go. Porter gathered her things.

She’d just spoken at an Urban League forum in San Francisco and was heading across the Bay Bridge to address union workers in Oakland.

The June 2 primary is some ways off. But Porter remains in the fight.

As far as first impressions go, new UCLA football coach Bob Chesney has been hitting the ball out of the park, according to high school coaches who have been receiving visits since Chesney started focusing on introducing himself to local coaches when the college transfer portal closed on Jan. 16.

“He’s a high-energy guy who has a clear vision,” St. John Bosco coach Jason Negro said. “He’s going to bring some excitement back. I was highly impressed. If he’s going to execute what his plan is, he’s going to have immediate success.”

There are so many Chesney sightings at high schools around Southern California, you have to wonder if he’s also scouting for a new house, but that’s probably left to his wife. On his visit to St. John Bosco, his driver was former St. John Bosco assistant Marshawn Friloux, a holdover in the Bruins’ recruiting department from the previous staff.

Bellflower coach Keith Miller, whose son, Austin, is one of the top tight ends from the class of 2029, got a school visit from Chesney, who also met Miller’s wife. Austin was offered a scholarship on Saturday after an unofficial visit to Westwood.

Miller said Chesney was eloquent and transparent, telling his son, “I didn’t just watch your film, I studied it and what stood out to me are the multiple efforts you make, especially your ‘scoop and score’ vs. Oxnard. Multiple effort playmakers are special. All great players have that trait. That’s what I love about you.”

UCLA has also been making early scholarship offers far more than the days when Chip Kelly refused to join that trend. Things started to change under former coach DeShaun Foster and Chesney’s new recruiting philosophy appears to be to get UCLA involved among multiple prospects in all grades and be competitive in Southern California, where coaches from USC, Oregon, California, Notre Dame, Nebraska, Oregon State and Washington were among those making the rounds last week while making scholarship offers.

As an example of the challenge Chesney faces, USC coach Lincoln Riley brought in the No. 1 recruiting class this year and was visiting the No. 1 player for the class of 2027 in California, defensive back/running back Honor Fa’alave-Johnson from San Diego Cathedral Catholic.

“I think he’s got a vision and a belief to develop kids and not create this transactional culture in college football,” Orange Lutheran coach Rod Sherman said of Chesney. “I think you’d be a fool to sleep on UCLA the next few years. He’s super personal. What I sense from him is they have well thought out recruiting strategy and they’re not throwing spaghetti against the wall. He knows which kids can be successful in his culture and system and thrive and love UCLA.”

But NIL resources remain critical in this new era, and some players and parents will continue to place that priority over others. That will require Chesney to find those “diamonds in the rough” from his James Madison coaching days.

Negro said, “He’s going to fit to what is needed for the program. He’s not normally going to focus just on the stars. He’s done that at a lower level. He’s going to find some foundational players. It’s going to be hard at first. If people have expectations they’re going to pull an Indiana, that’s premature. But UCLA is closer than people think. This guy is very dynamic, hard-driven and understands L.A.”

Said Servite coach Chris Reinert: “He’s doing things the right way. He seems to be hitting the ground running. He spent an hour here.”

Chesney promised in his opening news conference in December that he wanted to build relationships with high school coaches, and Negro confirmed Chesney is inviting coaches to visit UCLA. That’s not unusual. Reinert said USC’s Riley did the same.

Chesney dropped by City Section school Hamilton, which has a top Class of 2029 quarterback in Thaddeus Breaux. Then Breaux was offered a scholarship. Hamilton coach Elijah Asante said, “Coach Chesney is a grinder and he’s going to find those hidden gems.”

Expect more Chesney sightings this week until the recruiting period closes at the end of this week.

Don’t stop me if you’ve heard this one before, since I’m admittedly something of a broken record on the subject, but I very much prefer Marvel’s television series, which tend to be fleet, original and unpredictable, to its movies, which tend not to be. “Loki,” “Ms. Marvel,” “Moon Knight,” “Echo,” “WandaVision” and its spinoff “Agatha All Along” — all (among others) are worth watching, even the ones that are dumped after a season.

Developing longer stories with less money, the TV shows makers need to be inventive, creative with their resources, so they invest in characters and ideas rather than special effects and action. They focus on secondary or ensemble figures who would never be given a theatrical feature of their own to carry, are particular about culture and family and place, and are often less contingent on the Marvel Cinematic Universe, with its phases and stages, its crossovers and cross-promotions and long-range marketing plans. At once higher concept and more grounded than the movies, they’re interesting on their own, to the point where, when they finally hitch on to the Marvel multi-mega-serial train, I find them disappointing.

“Wonder Man,” whose eight episodes premiere all at once Tuesday on Disney+, is perhaps the most grounded of these series. Created by Destin Daniel Cretton (“Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings”) and Andrew Guest (who has written for “Community” and “Brooklyn Nine-Nine”), the series is a (generally) sweet, disarming tale of actors in Hollywood, tricked up with picture-business details that you don’t need to be au fait with the MCU to appreciate. There are things it might be helpful to know, but you can work out everything that matters through context. (Locals will enjoy playing Spot the Locations.)

Yahya Abdul-Mateen II plays Simon Williams, who as a child became a fan of a B-movie superhero called Wonder Man — not a “real” superhero, in this reality, merely a fiction. Now in his 30s, he’s a struggling actor in Hollywood, good enough to land a small part in an “American Horror Story” episode, but not clever enough to keep from slowing down the production with questions and suggestions when all he needs to do is deliver a couple of lines before a monster bites his head off. He loses the part and a girlfriend directly afterward.

Taking in a revival house matinee of “Midnight Cowboy,” he meets Trevor Slattery (Ben Kingsley), who is back from having played the Mandarin — that is, he acted the part of a terrorist called the Mandarin, believing it was just a job — in “Iron Man 3” and providing appealing comedy relief in “Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings.” The character here is more fleshed out, something of a mess (but 13 years sober, he likes to point out), serious but not a joke. Before it all went wrong, Trevor played King Lear (in Croydon), appeared in “Coronation Street” and in a movie with Glenda Jackson, was off-off-off Broadway in “The Skin Our Teeth” and briefly had the lead in a hospital show with Joe Pantoliano, who’s very funny playing himself.

Trevor Slattery (Ben Kingsley), left, and Simon Williams (Yahya Adbul-Mateen II) team up in “Wonder Man.”

(Suzanne Tenner / Marvel Television)

Slattery tells Simon that European art director Von Kovak (Zlatko Burić) is rebooting Wonder Man, a role Simon feels born to play. He makes an end run around his unconvinced agent, Janelle (X Mayo), and wheedles an audition — where he again meets Trevor, auditioning for Barnaby, Wonder Man’s pal, or sidekick or something. There are wheels behind wheels in this setup, some of which could use a little grease, but for most of the series they do their squeaking off to the side. It’s a love story, above all — “Midnight Cowboy,” not an accidental choice, is more of a touchstone than any Marvel movie.

Simon does have powers — things shake, break or explode around him when he’s upset, and his strength can become super in a tight spot — which puts him in the sights of the Department of Damage Control, embodied by Arian Moayed as P. Cleary, who would like to contain him. But he struggles to keep them secret, especially in light of something called the Doorman Clause — its history established in a sidebar episode, a cautionary Hollywood fable with Josh Gad as himself — which prohibits anyone with super powers from working in film or television, all Simon lives for.

There is little in the way of action, and you won’t miss it. The fate of the world is never in question, but a callback for a second audition means everything. The only costumed characters are actors playing costumed characters; the only villains, apart from the bureaucracy that seeks to bring him in, are Simon’s own self-doubt and temper. As things progress, Trevor will become a mentor to Simon. As is common in stories of love and friendship, a betrayal will be revealed, but if you have seen even a few such stories, you know how that’s going to go, and will be glad it does.

Whether discussing acting techniques or the traffic they’re stuck in on Hollywood Boulevard (Trevor: “Probably the Hollywood Bowl.” Simon: “It’s too late for the Bowl.” Trevor: “It’s usually the Bowl. I remember seeing Cher there once — breathtaking. Chaka Khan, now there’s a woman”), Abdul-Mateen and Kingsley work well together; their energies are complementary, laid back and loose versus worked up and tight and, of course, each will have something to teach one another about who they are and who they could be. I was genuinely anxious for them, as friends, more so than just wondering how such and such a superhero (or team) might defeat such and such a supervillain (or team).

“Our ideas about heroes and gods, they only get in the way,” says Von Kovak, putting a room of hopeful actors through their paces, and essentially speaking for the series he’s in. “Too difficult to comprehend them. Let’s find the human underneath.”